Louisa

totally agree with you jrthomas_uk, but dont try telling that to this lot or you'll be branded an extremist and locked away for life with the key thrown away! Louisa.

Oh dear, you see, this is the type of attitude which is bred from an age of 'knowing your rights'. I find this more offensive than any wrong doing done to a criminal. Louisa.

Moos, it is the position of the legal system to judge whether these members of staff overstepped the boundaries on this one, not MM or anyone else on this thread without knowing all the facts. I like the way so many people love to marginalise me and make me seem like some sort of mad woman, I find it hugely entertaining because I know that any sensible rational person would appreciate what I am saying and probably agree. The narrow minded views of so many do-gooders on here are what helps breed crime and encourage the media to defend the corner of the bad guy. Louisa.

Thanks for that sean, I appreciate your brilliant, wise and fully educated evaluation of my views! Louisa.

MM, how long were you and other witnesses watching this incident for? Do you know if there is anything which could have happened to cause the security staff to take these actions when perhaps you and others were not watching? I am sorry, but it is the role of any member of security staff to defend the shop from attack by opportunistic criminals, and if they felt it was necessary, then I am not going to question their judgement and neither should you or anyone else. Louisa.

HeidiHi, so ok we follow your route. The shoplifter may have been aggressive, should we just rely on CCTV in such circumstances and the door staff (who paid to catch criminals) should just let them run? Why have doorstaff then? Even if the criminal is not aggressive and fully co-operates with staff, they should still be made to feel small in front of others because regardless of what you say, it is a deterent. Discretion has always been used in the past, what is so different now? If we cannot trust people in a position of authority in a shop who has gone through interviewing procedures and has been given a job upon merit, then what is the point in having any job role that involves a certain amount of discretion? Louisa.

Moos, the problem with todays society is this whole culture of if's and but's. Yes there is a very remote posibility that members of staff may well accidently kill someone by using too much force, but then again what is too much force? Surely it would depend on the circumstances of the incident and then of course witnesses would be brought in to look at the specifics of the situation and take it from there. But let's not get away from the fact that if someone has taken it upon themselves to walk into your shop, house, break into car, then they should be the one who is worried for a number of reasons, firstly that the law allows discretion from people apprehending criminals, and secondly that the police and court's will not look lightly upon a person who has stolen from someone else. The whole culture of "oh the poor criminal" is just totally not right - we need to be getting away from that in my opinion. Louisa.

Louisiana, if Somerfield employ someone then it is down to them to contact the HR department and perhaps re-evaluate staff interviewing procedure. That is totally different from a stranger entering someone elses premises and stealing from them and expecting not to be dealt with in an aggressive fashion. Louisa.

HeidiHi, no offence but your attitude is the attitude of the type of person who gets laughed at in the face of the criminal. If people like you with your views did not exist, maybe we could actually punish these people more effectively without having the do-gooders standing outside court protesting and fighting the corner for the criminal. In my opinion it SHOULD be perfectly acceptable for a shoplifter (particuarly if known the security staff) to be handled with force and if necessary made to feel small and igsignificant. It cannot be right that a shop which is trading perfectly legally and within the law can find itself punished for the actions of a criminal - handled with force or not. Dont do the crime in the first bloody place, no sympathy for the shoplifter, every sympathy for the poor staff members who felt they were doing the right thing. This is why the hands of the police are tied so heavily in this country, do-gooders dictating what is right and wrong without accepting a person in the position is good enough to use discretion. Makes me sick to be honest! Louisa.

Rockets exactly, this is the type of attitude so many people around here take about crime, it makes me sick, until of course it happens to them then they come on here up in arms complaining. This person if guilty deserved everything they suffered and more in my eyes, sorry if thats difficult for some of you to stomach! Louisa.

I totally disagree with most of what everyone has so far said. This person (and lets face it we dont know all the facts) could well have been handled with such force because they had threatened members of staff or other customers, maybe they had a weapon on them? How can you all say that it was too heavy handed without being in the situation the poor staff found themselves where they have to juggle the rights of the shoplifter to be handed over to relevant authorities, and the risk they may pose to others? None of us are in a position to judge. I am sure the security staff can use their discretion on the elderly person or mentally ill person who walks out without paying, and the devious shoplifter who makes it a living. I tell you one thing though, if I was a shoplifter reading this or seeing what happened in Somerfield, I would make sure I never stole from there that's for sure. Good on the Somerfield staff I say (if this was a guilty shoplifter). Louisa.

I dont get this, how about we just put a sign outside Somerfield saying something along the lines of "Shoplifters come in and feel free to steal items, chances are if you are caught you might end up being arrested but only if our staff can be arsed to apprehend you because they dont like being heavy handed", ridiculous. Lad's getting a little tipsy outside a nightclub, as long as they have not been causing trouble inside the club, then that is obviously not good, but lets remember this shoplifter (if guilty) was on someone's premises taking what was rightfully not their's to take. If someone broke into my house I would not hesitate to grab a hammer from the tool box and whack them one. Dont steal from Somerfield, then there is no reason for the security staff to be aggressive towards you is there. Louisa.

I agree it is right and just that law enforcers should deal with such crimes as shoplifting, but equally it is about time the victim of the crime (in this case somerfield and their staff) should be allowed to use force to contain violence that may occur. We do not know the in's and out's of this case, perhaps the person involved was found with a weapon? Would we rather the security staff took a light handed approach and the person attacked innocent people shopping in Somerfield? Who get's the blame then if someone is hurt, the staff for not controlling the situation better. Sorry but a heavy hand in such situations works better than allowing the thief to get away with it. As for the second incident MM, that is a completely different scenario and I commend you for stepping in to at least try and calm the situation down. I have been involved in such incidents and I can assure you I take great pride in helping people who are in trouble and cannot defend themselves. I do however believe it would have been better if transport police or security staff had been patrolling said train or station to prevent such an incident. Louisa.

Sorry if this person was caught shoplifting how is it unnecessary to use violence against them? Maybe a pat on the head and a stern waging of the finger would be more suitable in your eyes? Louisa.

I agree the flower bed was lovely, it would have been nice to have kept a variety of flowers instead of a foreign tree which looks out of place. Louisa.

I would scrap Council Tax for the over 60's, grant a ?1000 winter fuel grant to everyone over 65, and provide free pensioner passes for taxi services as the buses and trains would be discontinued. Louisa.

Sean, I dont care whos house the new bigger roads go through, as long as it means less traffic jams and better quality roads, oh and how about as an aside we get rid of bloody speed bumps. ED would be such a mervelous place, it would be the car friendly wonder of the world (secondly only to Milton Keynes). Louisa.

AcedOut, how about we dont do that. I am more than happy with a statue of me surveying the view of the new Louisa friendly ED. Louisa.

I would have all the buses and trains sold off to American theme parks and pump the funds into better quality roads, bigger and with less traffic lights. I would also consider banning freedom of religion, with all churches mosques and other places of worship to be closed with immediate effect and all religious practises to be done at home and not in congregations. As for drugs, I wouldnt mind a canabis shop on LL, and maybe a gay leather bar. Louisa.

They can walk cant they? I thought we had an obesity timebomb on our hands, i'd be doing everyone a favour. God I should be a local councillor. Louisa.

Sean, I like to see myself as a kind of modern day heroine for the afflicted working class locals who want order and discipline to return to the local community. I think I could make it work, dont you? Louisa.

Never seen such a ridiculous spectacle in all my life. I think it would be more at home in Kew than round here, in fact how about somewhere in the Caribbean or Pacific? What an utter waste of my council tax. I have a crap waste dispoal service, the police and other public services are rarely if ever used (and if they are they turn out to be not very helpful). I think this thing should be put back in it's rightful home and a statue of me should be erected on the roundabout, I might be a little less p*ssed off about how wasteful this council is then! Louisa.

I would ban all public transport - especially buses grrr I would ban all parking wardens with immediate effect and allow cars to park anywhere they like. I would close down every single boutique style shop on LL with immediate effect for whatever reasons I could think of. I would give community support officers guns so that they could take control of the streets and keep the youth under control. I would make sure spitting, littering, doo pooing and swearing in public was an on the spot fine on ?1000 and if not paid the old bill come and arrest their arse. God I can but dream! Louisa.

Ladies and gents can we drop the toilet humour please - I think this poor chap may well have been affected by this mysterious ED stomach bug that has been doing the rounds, perhaps we should randomly put loo rolls outside our front gates to help aid the aflicted in these dark times. Louisa.

I love a flutter every so often, it is a great social ocassion to go into a bookies and watch the racing. It is something the yummy middle class twits who have moved into this area cannot appreciate. The thought of a bookies creates stereotypical images of old men chain smoking and using inappropriate language. Get over it I say, it's better than yet another boutique no one ever goes into because it's all crap and overpriced. Louisa.