bobbsy

Thank you providing the link. However, the points made in the "broader benfits of 20mph" read just as subjectively as most of our arguements against 20mph on this thread. I feel closer packed traffic makes it less easy for cars to turn into traffic. He feels it makes it easier for cars to turn into traffic etc etc. I won't go through them 1 by 1, but hasn't done anything to convice me. I think introduction of blanket 20mph speed limits is an easy way for local government to give the appearance they are improving road safety for constituents without really having to do any work, and one that is hard to disprove its said benefits as there is little useful research available.

I would still, if all the statisticians who are quoting research can tell me, love to see the accident figures on a per mile figure of 20mph limited roads versus a per mile figure of 30mph limited roads. All we have seen so far is that accidents in 20mph zones are less than in 30mph zones, as there were far far far less 20mph zones than 30's when this was undertaken.

Sorry, I don't buy it. Cars closer together feel to me to be less safe. Peoples reaction times dont change with speed, but you're right, stopping distance does. However experience so far - people are tailgating much much closer when I stick to 20mph. Add to that - with closer distance beteen cars, there is less scope for other cars to turn onto roads from side roads, therefore I think people will push out into potentially unsafe manouvres, and pedestrians wil have less room to cross between cars, whhioch I think will lead to more pedestrian "darting" across roads. Yes, these are all feelings, but backed up with my observations. This morning I stuck to 25mph, and had a bus sitting on my rear about as close as they could possibly get. It felt very unsafe. Other users can quote millions of statistics, but in a nutshell, I don't believe 20mph will provide safer environments on the road.

mako Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > A simple example would be waiting longer at > traffic lights as queues longer. at thirty more > cars would have made it through "Flow rates increase at lower speeds because cars can be closer together. " And mako, doesn't this completely counter the arguement that slower speed limits reduce accidents by increasing the the amount of time people have to react and make decisions? If we all drive closer together and the traffic is more densely packed I think (and no, its not backed by Local Government reasearch, which of course would always be of the highest quality, and completely unbiased) accidents will increase.

All this stuff about average speeds in London being sub 20mph is probably true. But these figures apply to all London, and will be skewed enormously by central central London figures. We are talking about Dulwich roads, which are not as congested as the city centre. 30mph is a sensible limit for main thoroughfares, especially outside peak hours. But very very few people observe the 20mph limit. I ride into town almost every day, and am constantly tailgated even at 30mph. And, as I have pointed out before, the residential road I live ojn has been 20mph for a long time, and hardly anyone observes that. Money would have been much better spent on other projects. Bring back weekly refuse collection I say.

The majority when I am on the road or looking out the window.

A blanket 20mph limit will also entice more people to duck and dive through the smaller residential streets rather than use the larger roads that were designed for heavier traffic. The speed limit on my road has been 20 for ages, plus it has numerous speed bumps, but as it is a handy shortcut to avoid lordship lane, the majority of cars roar along at 30-40mph. also, the navigation apps, when updated to the new limits, will start directing drivers off the main roads when calculating fastest journey time. how has that made things safer?

Touche!

Blah Blah, I agree with you. Completely. I suspect a lot of the people supporting the 20mph limits are non drivers.

Nunhead_man - would like to see figures per mile...sorry if its buried deep in the article, I just skimmed it. Love the picture attached though!

James, I think I understand your meaning. Different residents will have different opinions. I obviously have the contrary opinion to many. During peak hours, speed limits are basically irrelevent anyway, but during quiet times I would appreciate being able to travel with a 30mph limit. With blanket 20mph limits, what incentive do drivers have to travel to and use main roads? I could see an incease of traffic through smaller (more) residential roads - which I what I would prefer not to happen.

That's probably right, average speeds in London are <20, but that was including 30mph zones...so now the average will fall further. Please don't get me wrong - for non-main roads, I have no problem with 20mph. But for main thoroughfares, I believe 30mph is appropriate. I would rather see a 30mph limit enforced, than a 20mph limit consistently ignored.

This was a bit further up, coming down the hill from the mini-sainsburys, towards the police station. Part of the confusing area, as 20 signs (heading north) start just after the south circular, then are quite random until the main high street.

I have to agree - I just posted on another thread about this, but 20mph blanket limit is ridiculous. Back to 30mph please.

I posted about this yesterday, and some observations this morning. Driving north on lordship lane, a bus was observing the speed limit - and the line of about 10 cars behind, all as close as possible to each other, were all itching to get past this "slow" bus, each one constantly inching right to see past the next vehicle, into the path of oncoming traffic. It's currently not very safe at all. Ok, maybe with time and education people will realise its a 20 limit, but 20 for most of the main roads is a ridiculous limit, it feels like a snails pace, and it will not be observed. Abolish it. Now.

Completely confusing at the moment. Signs for 20 in some areas, and for one direction but not the other on the same road (forest hil road near the speed cameras being a good example). As far as I am remember, the traffic code says all roads are 30 unless constantly signposted with another limit? I find 20 a good idea on small residential roads, but ridiculous on main roads. 30 is an appropriate limit, and traffic need to flow!

Completely agree with west wickham route...quiet country lanes within 20mins of east dulwich.