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There is no alternative for redressing the impacts of bias. If we want to get to a place of true meritocracy, there have to be role models and peers for all ethnic groups to aspire to. That can be done in different ways though. For example, I would argue that one of the better ways to empower young people is through education and history. Who were the trailblazers for them? This is why something like Black History Month has positive value imo, and it is a history we all should learn, because it is a shared history in many parts. Eventually that will help feed down to a mindset of equality hopefully.

Heartblock is spot on. For all those reasons, things are going to get worse, a lot worse, if government dithers too much on efforts to slow spread. Some would argue they have already missed the point at which a significant difference could be made, but it will be on their heads if SAGE advice they ignored, evolves into a crisis that could have been mitigated. My prediction? Boris replaced by the end of January or February, and not by Gove either, but Sunak. There won't be any shift in direction or outcome until that corrupt Tory leadership and their cronies are gone.

The bubble thing is explained here; https://inews.co.uk/news/uk/support-bubble-tier-2-3-what-rules-covid-restrictions-social-explained-713956 Agreed on simply delaying the inevitable. Liverpool now only has 10 percent of ICU capacity free. The issue I have with the tier system, is that without honesty around failings by government, and honesty about public behaviour, there is little point in these intermediate restrictions. Once infection rates are on that exponential curve, it becomes very difficult to slow down without draconian measures. This seems to be the very thing the government are now ignoring.

The libertarian right stance on Brexit DR is not as out of sync with covid restrictions as you might think. Those people only care about personal profit over regulation. Brexit for them was about removing regulation, like employment rights and food standards.They never actually care if anyone else earns enough or lives. In other words, whether it is EU regulation or a pandemic, how dare any of it get in the way of their ability to make money, and as much of it as possible.

It is all very well someone saying 'what right to government have to condemn someone to an untimely death due to the wider impact of a lockdown' but that is said in complete ignorance of the impact of hospitals filled with covid patients also condemned to untimely deaths - some 40k plus so far. It is not a binary issue and I wish those taking binary positions would remember that. For example, there are almost 8.8 million people over the age of 70 in the UK. Of those that get covid in that age group, 1 in 20 die. That is before we get into the number of people who need ICU care and recover. If we do not limit the spread of the virus, what do those complaining about restrictions think is going to happen? You can not isolate almost 9 million people from a virus spreading freely. So there is no question that there have to be efforts to restrict spread of the virus. The difficult part is in knowing how long that approach can be sustained before economics and other factors become more critical. And then we really do get into the terrain of discussions around the value of life. There are of course, lots of differing views on that too.

The scenes from Liverpool are precisely why half-hearted measures on pubs are not going to work. Government to be fair, is trying to keep businesses open to protect the country from having a full economic meltdown, but if people won't do as they are asked, it is inevitable that a second full lockdown will come. Christmas especially, is going to be real challenge, as millions of people travel around the country to be with family and friends, and fill any bars or restaurants that are open. The government can close the bars and restaurants, but it is very hard to see how people can be stopped from observing any rules on travel and numbers of people mixing in homes at Christmas itself. Cue a spike around the end of January.

I think all the proposals are a good idea. The number of times the EDR junctions severely flood in winter from water run and drains that can not cope is all the evidence needed to see that something needs to happen. Perhaps some kind of underground storm drain through the park down to the sewer would help too.

Also, it provides an out for government in the blame game. Only, it it becomes one part of the public blaming another in reality (divide and rule yet again). Today it has emerged that government largely ignored the advice of SAGE over the recent days, on the way to proceed. We will see what happens to the infection rates over the coming weeks to see who was right.

The next four weeks will probably decide the future of Harding. If the government track and trace fails to keep up with infection rates, then we will switch to a localised setup with money going directly to local authorities. Persisting with expensive contracts (given to Tory party chums) that do not deliver, will not be tolerated for much longer I think.

I have to agree diable. March and April were awful for the NHS. Being able to manage the virus and avoid a repeat of that always depended on getting a working track and trace system in place, and the public doing their part. There is no excuse for the lack of delivery of the former. And on the latter, it was always going to be a challenge in a country that is densely populated by a public who in significant part, do not have the kind of self discipline the Scandinavians do for example. Bear in mind, that daily stats are a measure of where the transmission rate was two weeks ago. Allowing for exponential percentages, we are going to be back in full lockdown territory within weeks. It is that longish incubation period that is the problem when it comes to accurately knowing infection rates. To give credit to Boris today, he seems to finally have ditched the bravado and false promises. When asked about a vaccine, he was candid and pointed out that Sars Cov 1 still has no vaccine after 14 years. There is going to have to be some thinking now about how we live with this virus longer term, if indeed it takes 3 or more years to find a vaccine. And that sadly is going to mean seasonal closures of spaces where people congregate.

It isn't clear on the Weatherpoons thing. Tier 3 seems to include ALL pubs and bars, but not restaurants. Weatherspoons is not a restaurant chain.

Yes to all of that Spartacus.

Pretty grim assessment from the government briefing that just took place, including the evidence that you can not protect older ages groups when spread occurs in other age groups. Something needs to change. Government seems to still be resisting a localised track and trace system. Also evidence emerging that lockdown measures were lifted too early in the North, although I personally doubt that would have made much of a difference over time. If people genuinely want to avoid restrictions and lockdowns, everyone has to do their part to minimise the risk of spread, but government also needs to follow the most effective methods of tracking spread. Unless both of those things happen, I suspect we'll be in a far worse place than we were back in March and April before the Winter is out. Sky just reported that hospital admissions in Liverpool are the third highest in Europe now. That should concern everyone.

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Outside has been safer during the summer, but that changes when people start getting seasonal colds and coughs. If you are in proximity to someone who sneezes or coughs infection (of any kind) indoors or outside, then there is a risk of catching the infection. This is why there have been real concerns about the Winter and a potential second wave.

All of that is true and it is also where I think government messaging has gone wrong. There has never been any emphasis placed on the percentage of healthy people that need ICU care to recover (a far higher number than those who die) and nor has there been enough conversation about the irregular conditions that this virus seems to also induce, like a higher incidence of strokes. All of those things need much longer term monitoring to fully understand the scale and implications of. Also true to say is that you can not achieve herd immunity with a virus that induces weak immune responses that drop off after six months. Rhinoviruses are a good example of that. And even with viruses that induce long lasting immune responses, herd immunity is rarely achieved without the help of a working vaccine. Then we get into mutations, which is why we have to develop a new vaccine for flu every year. So what is the rational response moving forward? To be honest about the pernicious nature of this virus and all its complications. To enforce the rules around masks, washing hands and social distancing, because those things combined DO work to slow spread and reduce infection. Business will adapt, and indeed, many businesses (including pubs) are operating effective ways of operating safely. We are not going back to crowded environments until this virus is dealt with one way or another. Even entertaining a notion of a world where the young can move freely while everyone over fifty has to live under restrictions and isolation will be political suicide for a party, and anyway, will fail to stop spread into those more vulnerable groups. There are other views of course, but they need to come with an honesty about what level of illness and death is acceptable to them. Then we can have a discussion about that benchmark. Just ignoring that factor isn't helpful.

They do and they are usually far bigger than that. The other thing that occurred to me, looking at the grooves, is as some part of a pulley system, with the rope gripping in those side grooves. The beam going through it then in turn, turns something else.

It is too small for a millstone. My guess would be a grinding stone to sharpen tools.

Indeed, we have discussed the role of class in privilege elsewhere, and how that cuts across ethnic groups. Those with the geniune privilege love to resort to divide and rule when the heat is on anyway.

Especially when they pull stunts like this. https://news.sky.com/story/coronvairus-dr-johnny-bananas-and-dr-person-fakename-among-medical-signatories-on-herd-immunity-open-letter-12099947?fbclid=IwAR3WRzrrsJqgkhz4GTr_xnJ0chw0lGZuzUPnW_WkSDYfu8ahPGZSY4GToCw There is an inevitability to all of this, and the reason I keep asking TE44 that question on deaths is because I think that he/she would be the first to complain if we saw the full force of this virus, and be demanding government did something. This is not flu or a common cold. The public for the most part have taken that seriously but sadly, some will never understand that unless we unleash it to do its worst. KK, I hope your relatives both make full recoveries. Not an easy time for you I know.

Back at ya. I can do pompous too. Would you like some links to peer reviewed neuroscience research around unconscious bias instead?

TheCat once again ignores the crux of my post and tries to find an issue when there isn't one. If someone finds it difficult to understand a person's accent and says so, fine. If they then throw in some comment about their origin, then that may be an indicator of something else, unconscious or otherwise. And no, not all Brits do sound the same. I have been to some parts of Scotland and struggled to understand the slang spoken.

Unconscious bias often is defined by race and there is lots of psychological research into this, that we have unconscious aversions to those who do not look like us. Disability is included in that along with ethnicity. For example, we are more likely to define a different culture that also belongs predominantly to people of a different ethnic group by that ethnicity, than we are to one from our own ethnic group. So this is how some people end up tarring all Muslims as the same (when there are fifty different national cultures depending on the Islamic country, and even more depending on the non Islamic countries) but don't apply the same blanket view to the wide range of different Christian denominations in the World. Struggling to understand a persons speech for example is another good example. There are many dialects/ accents, with all their slang that other Brits would struggle to understand. But a person would never say 'I don't mind scousers, but I do struggle to communicate well with the new village shopkeeper'. It is the need to make a point of someone being 'not of this country' that is the issue, when what the woman could say instead, is that she struggles to understand his accent, and leave the immigrant comment out of it altogether. Language matters.

And like a broken record, TE44 still won't answer the core question. How many people have to die to define a pandemic? Infection rates are rising again. So too are hospital admissions and deaths. Only a fool can not see the correlation between that and lifting lockdown. So I ask you again TE44, how many people have to be dying each day before you recognise a pandemic. Clearly a 900 a day back in April was not enough for you. Nor is in excess of 1 million globally either. When you answer that question with a figure, then we can talk about the outliers you keep citing vs the core consensus of 99 percent of everyone else. And fyi, I am going to keep asking you that question until you answer it. So you may as well.

Still not answering that question are you though? Yet you feel free to throw around hypothesized figures on other things. Hypocritical to the core.