nanny off sick a lot

[dairymilkfiend]

Dear All,

Does anyone know where I stand with my relatively new nanny who has been off sick for 3 whole weeks over the 3 months we have employed her so far? This includes several times when she has texted me first thing in the morning telling me she will not be in that day. Does that sound an 'unreasonable' amount of time off? The illnesses have been unconnected and it has caused real problems for my work, not to mention my lovely friends and family who have all pitched in to help. Should I start a verbal warning/ written warning system? Her contract just says we need to give her 4 weeks notice, but I'm unsure if it would be illegal to fire her if she continues to be off sick frequently. Hope it doesn't sound callous, but we both have jobs in healthcare, so my patients and colleagues suffer if I can't go in.

Any advice gratefully received!

[Fuschia]

if you have employed her for only 3 months she doesn't have employment protection except for certain types of discrimination and certain other circumstances

If you are thinking of letting her go, do it before the year is up.

[ryedalema]

That's a difficult one - is she off for long stretches at a time or is it one day at a time? You can ask her for sick notes if it is for an extended period (not sure what the length is nowadays though). If it were me I'd treat her the same as my members of staff at work where we have a return to work 'are you fit' interview, even if they are off for half a day. It's not onerous but makes sure that they are not coming back before they should, and also helps to uncover any underlying issues that might be contributing to the sickness. It is difficult to chastise 'sickness' with verbal/formal warnings but if you can find any evidence that they aren't kosher (have you looked at Face book, or does she get a sudden sun tan, for instance?) then you have much better grounds.

It's so horrid when childcare is unreliable - as if we don't have enough to deal with. I feel for you as, if the sicknesses are genuine, then it's very hard to sort out something else.

[Fuschia]

It sounds like DMF might just like to give her 4 weeks notice, and she would be within her rights to do so, as the nanny hasn't worked for a year and gained employment protection

[Fuschia]

Law re unfair dismissal:

http://www.compactlaw.co.uk/monster/empf1.html

http://www.compactlaw.co.uk/monster/empf3.html

[EDmummy]

You should probably give her a chance to explain her absences in case there is an issue that is covered by the Disability Discrimination Act.

[Fuschia]

EDmummy Wrote:

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> You should probably give her a chance to explain

> her absences in case there is an issue that is

> covered by the Disability Discrimination Act.

Yes, as that is one of the cases where unfair dismissal can be claimed without the 1 year's continuous employment. Pregnancy is another.

[Fliss]

That's a huge amount of time to have off sick. She sounds flakey. If she had a genuine health problem she would have told you about it by now. An unreliable nanny is no use to you. I'd sack her. She won't try and claim unfair dismissal after only three months, especially when she must be aware that she has had too much time off. Did she give you references when you employed her?

[littleEDfamily]

Ok, this is going to sound really callous (and by the way all the advice above is sound), but bear in mind the time, effort and money it takes to bring a claim for discrimination, or even breach of contract (which would be the only claims I can see she may be able to bring, and the latter only if you don't pay her notice, the former only if she is a 'protected group'), it is probably not necessary to 'pussyfoot' around.

As someone else has suggested, give her a chance to explain herself (and for you to establish whether she would be protected under any disability discrimination legislation), and then if no red flags, just serve notice and be done with it! Depending on what the contract says, you may be able to pay her in lieu of notice. You can almost certainly have her work her notice, but in my experience, this can be very uncomfortable for both parties. It's worth a shot to try and mutually agree a shorter notice period (she won't be able to take another job while she is employed by you still and she may decide it is preferable to secure another job quickly rather than work out her notice?)

Have you been you paying her sick pay when she has been off?

[Claire29]

I have had some rubbish experience's with past nannies so I would be inclined to sack her, pay whatever she is due and look for someone else. It is obv more hard to do this if she is a really great nanny and kids like her, but even still it's not fair on you to always be worrying will she turn up or wont she.

[womanofdulwich]

Again I would say did you get references- can you rememebr what they said? were they guarded in anyway? could you all them back and double check?

These are very bad signs as most nannies I have had would call me and explain if they were not well but would coem and "babysit" and not go out etc. that is always better thatn letting your employer down. or having to call on family members an friends to assist.

if you give her notice be warned she may be ill throughout that too- or even just leave.

[busymum]

can't you tell her your circumstances have changed, you no longer need a nanny because of redundancy, reduction of hours etc etc

sorry if this is unhelpful

[littleEDfamily]

Busymum has a point. It will be horrible to go through a process of sacking on the grounds of unacceptable sickness. If you do decide it's best to let her go, it may be easier to keep things sweet with her during her notice period (assuming you'd need her to work) by saying that you are being made redundant (or whatever). If you do decide to be brave and sack on the basis of her sickness and she subsequently takes the P by not coming in, so long as you have reasonable grounds to believe she is not genuinely ill and therefore guilty of serious misconduct, you may well be able to terminate with immediate effect (not a risk free option, but you may decide saving yourself a significant amount of money is preferable to being totally risk averse on the basis that she MAY subsequently be able to bring a successful claim.

[Fliss]

I don't think people should feel afraid to sack someone who is not doing what they said they would do at the interview. Someone who is being sacked for poor performance should be told just that. All this fear of being sued is just silly. Pay her till the end of the week.

[Fuschia]

My suggestion was that she just gives the 4w notice if she's unhappy, doesn't neceessarily need to give a reason

[Moos]

An employer has a duty of care to treat an employee fairly - that includes checking whether there is a health problem that she hasn't yet told you about and giving her a chance to explain her situation. If you're not happy with the explanation, you can tell her you're letting her go because you find her unreliable. I would suggest that you pay her whatever notice you have agreed with her and ask her to work it to give you both a reasonable chance to find another job.

Hope it works out for you - I'm sure this is very stressful.

[ljs]

Gosh, that is a lot of time off. Im my days as working as a nanny I remember crawling into work somedays, even if I felt ill I went in and just had a quiet day at home with the children. I knew how important it was for my then bosses to get into work on time.

One family that I worked for were so impressed that i had worked for them for 3 years without one day off sick that they paid me a very large bonus when i did leave...

Maybe a call to your nanny and have a chat to her saying that you are concerned about her health and is there anything that you can do to help her out... maybe from the conversation you can tell if she is really THAT ill or just playing you along !! Remind her that you need to be able to go to work and that how hard you are finding it to cope and that your children need some sort of routine/stability by her being ther for them as she said she would be.

Is she happy working for you,what did her past employers say about her time keeping ??

If she's not been working for you long, is she still on her probationary period... most of my jobs always had a 3 month probationary period where either side could give short notice if things weren't working out.

Hope you manage to resolve the situation soon.

ps. I also think that texting in is very rude and not professional at all.

[LaineyB]

As a nanny I think it is pretty appalling! I have nannied in my current job for over a year and have taken not one sick day! Despite being Ill! I feel in our job we commit so you have extra benifits to nursery and childminders. Hence why we get paid more because we commit to giving you 100% all of the time as people who employ nannies generally need complete and consistent care. I feel her priorities are lacking and if this is her approach to her job role initially she will Give you even less in commitment In the future.

You should definately dismiss her appropriately and find a great nanny, there Are lots of great one out there!

Hope this helps as it's from a nannies point of view.

:)

[dairymilkfiend]

Thanks to all for your support - its good to know my feelings are justified. We did take up references from 3 previous employers and I specifically asked all of them about sick leave. None said that she had taken more than a couple of days so we may just have been unlucky, but who knows?

The difficult thing is that the kids adore her and we had a lot of trouble finding a nanny, so I am dreading having to do it again. I think I will sit down with her next week and explain our expectations - I agree with ljs that most good nannies will drag themselves into work and just have a quiet day at home if they are unwell. (Ljs - you don't want a job do you?!)

[ljs]

How very sweet of you to say that.. I absolutely loved all of my jobs working as a nanny and I feel really cross when some people don't see it as a "proper job" and let their employers down, she wouldn't get away with it in any other job... I now have two children of my own so am now a SAHM... I do miss the work thing though...

Hope all is resolved soon.

[jacqueline25]

As a childminder looking after three children a day all from different family's. you know lot's of people are relying on you i've just got home from the doctor's and have been told i've got bronchitis will still be working tomorrow i've had two days sick in 15years so i can't see why LaineyB thinks nanny's are more reliable.

[vinceayre]

Do you pay her when she is off?

[dairymilkfiend]

yes we do pay her. I think she is entitled to paid sick leave, unless she is off for more than 2 consecutive weeks after which you start paying her half pay.

[Fuschia]

dairymilkfiend Wrote:

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> yes we do pay her. I think she is entitled to paid

> sick leave, unless she is off for more than 2

> consecutive weeks after which you start paying

> her half pay.

I think it will depend on your contract

[vinceayre]

Stop paying her and she will stop being sick, check your contract all you have to pay is SSP.