Mums with cleaners

[Mellors]

I am a SAHM with a cleaner.

My husband and I decided when we first got married pre-kids that ?30 a week was cheaper than a divorce, which is what would have ensued if we had carried bickering and being resentful about who's turn it was to clean the loo and who had made a mess of the kitchen sink.

With three under 5s at home we need it more than ever now, just to keep some semblance of order briefly once a week.

[cuppa tea]

The best way to teach young boys to clean is by having their dads set a good example by doing the cleaning themselves! You can't underestimate role modelling :)

[Fuschia]

mrs f Wrote:

------------------------------------------------------- and I would rather he spent is time

> How do you

> do it without one Fuchsia?

>

Since I went back to work we have been living in such a messy muddle I had to get emergency cleaning assistance last week, actually

I don't know about cleaning but I need to be about 10 people as it is ... On the days I don't go in to work not only I wrangling two toddlers, looking after one (admittedly pretty chilled out baby) laundry for 6

, cooking, school run etc ... But I am also supposed to be working at home.

Hence I do everything probably at about 50% competence and make up the shortfalls mostly late evenings and weekends

I think I am convincing myself a regular cleaner is required here too!

[pebbles]

we have had a cleaner since we got married and both agreed that if we had to budget to the nth degree, our cleaner would be the last thing to go. and that is still the case now with me being at home with both kids. i'm messy, the kids are messy (i'd like to think my house is clean!!!) but without our cleaner the house would be horrendous and as most people have stated, they feel it's more important being with the kids than cleaning!!

however womanofdulwich has picked up on a point that has concerned me. so, although i tidy my kids don't see me clean and it's really hit me recently (dare i say due to pebbles jrn saying when i got out the hoover the other day, why are you using "cleaners" hoover!!! - it shocked me it really did. so with that and also reading this thread although i will continue to use her, i will also start trying to get the kids to "clean" - whether that be the bath while they're in it or wash the windows (which they both love to do), the last thing i want is for them to leave home and not be domesticated.

I agree with Moos, i don't think it's a sahm vs working mum argument - i think it's a what people want to spend their money on argument!!

[Huggers]

I believe in old fashioned feminist ideals of wages for housework and so feel no guilt in paying a proffessional to do it for me. As long as that person is paid a proper and not exploitative wage.

[cuppa tea]

"I believe in old fashioned feminist ideals of wages for housework and so feel no guilt in paying a proffessional to do it for me. As long as that person is paid a proper and not exploitative wage."

I would bet all your cleaners are women though?

[sophiechristophy]

Bluesuperted - I totally agree, the name of this thread is so sexist! In fact, Seeing as she's paid with my husband's wages, I suppose our cleaner is technically his and not mine at all!!!! I know I know, they're OUR wages...

[Fuschia]

I meant it really as 'talk about it, you mums here who have cleaners' rather than that the cleaners don't benefit thd whole family

Though I suspect thd cleaners were mostly appointed by and are supervised by thd mothers rather than the fathers

[toast]

bluesuperted Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> In the light of all this talk of domestic

> equality, can we please change the thread title to

> 'families with cleaners' then??

>

:)-D

Exactly, why are we framing the question to make ourselves feel guilty? Families benefit from having the extra help, not just mums.

[susyp]

i am with the likes of cuppatea who just have a house that is never cleaned. I would have got a cleaner but wasn't worth the fight with my husband over it. It has got a bit easier as she has got older but i really cannot wait until she is in nursery next term when I will get a few hours of day to get control of the house and all the boxes we still have everywhere from our move 3 years ago! Reassuring to know that our parents just left us to scream - i have been wondering how it ever got done and my mum just looks at me blankly when I ask but I also know she didn't go to groups or do the stuff I do with my daughter.

Susypx

[bluesuperted]

Our cleaner is female but we had a male one once... And in our case (but granted it's unusual) my husband definitely takes charge of supervising her work (see earlier post re: his OCD cleaning tendencies...)!

[reneet]

I was a SAHM for 2 years after my first and had no cleaner, never even thought about it and the house work was mainly managable. I then went back to work full time and it was a nightmare not having a cleaner but Mr. R pitched in with the housework and we managed. Then I got pregnant with no.2 and things went downhill house was constantly messy and then a month ago we moved houses, and it was a nightmare having to unpack and get things together at over 20 wks pregnant. Now at 32 weeks I cannot do it so this weekend we got ourselves a cleaner, and personally i think its the best decision we ever made had several hours saturday morning with nothing to do no bathroom to scrub, floors to polish and it felt perfect. We decided to have one until i have the baby and then a month after that, so we will see how it goes.

I think have a cleaner if you want one and can afford one, nothing to feel guilty about, its all boils down to personal preferences.

[sophiechristophy]

Why would anyone not have one? Who likes cleaning? I can't believe it took us so long to get our cleaner.

[Huggers]

Cuppatea, currently our cleaner is a woman yes and has been with us 10 years. Why would it be more likely to be a woman? Possibly because its self employed work that can be fitted around the cleaners own childrens' school day.

So I'm not sure that your 'i bet your cleaner is a woman' is an assumption that I am discriminating against men or that only women take the job.

If a woman is paid a proper wage for her job - and it's not a situation where a man would be paid more- I see no conflict with feminism. Or are you assuming cleaning is only womans work?

In fact thinking as cleaning as something you cannot outsource without creating a social unfairness is the very opposite of what it is.

In reality you are passing more money into the economy. I get paid something for my self employed work, which I have time to do because I have a cleaner, and I pass some of that wage to someone else to do the thing that otherwise I would do for free, which would mean I would earn less and the money I earnt would not pass to anyone.

When I did my economics A level I remember a teacher saying a huge irritation to the economy was the d.i.y enthusiast who caused an cash flow cul de sac by not passing on part of their wage to carpenters, etc. Though you could argue it is passed to B&q- which is why we are a nation of shop keepers.

You'll find that a more regulated cleaning day demanded by care homes for instance, will often be worked by men.

Sometimes people work as cleaners while they are studying or it can be just a work stage in someone's life.

My sister was a cleaning lady for a couple of years- she is a brilliant re-inventor of roles and described herself as a 'gentleman's help'. That was not a feminist definition of herself at all. On the other hand she could charge loads of dosh for doing a cleaners job.

[cuppa tea]

@ Huggers - No I wasn't implying that you were in any way sexist for employing a woman over a man. I was finding it interesting from a 'wages for housework' point of view. I would guess that there are far more female domestic cleaners than men, because although they are paid above minimum wage (hopefully) I doubt very much that men would do that kind of work for that little money. We are still delegating 'women's work' to another woman. It's more what it says about how society is set up than anything else. I wasn't thinking about it from personal situations. I would say that female cleaners clean to fit in around their children. They probably do then go home and clean their own houses and manage their own families. If parents were paid to look after their own children and do their own house work, women wouldn't have to go out and clean other people's homes and then come back and do their own.

[helena handbasket]

I have on several occasions found my four year old dusting my living room. When I ask what he's doing, he says "I can't stand to look at this dust for one more minute". He does quite a thorough job, I have to say.

It may be time to hire a cleaner.

[blainiac]

I am a SAHM who ogles my male cleaner while he does the ironing, as I watch daytime telly and smoke fags.

My toddler meanwhile messes up the house for my cleaner to sort out while spilling Fruit Shoots all over the carpet and crushing jammy dodgers into the walls and furniture.

My husband thinks the cleaner is excellent value at ?10 per hour.

[Ruth_Baldock]

Helena; I think your Mini Handbasket and my Cheeky S should team up. Seb won't continue eating if he drops food on the floor and it's not cleaned up. He also won;t get into the bath until he's put his toys away in the living room, takes off his socks and puts them in the washing maching, and won't get into bed if there are toys/clothes on the floor. He won't let me help, he has to clean it up himself. Hilarious.

Think of the money to be made!!!!!

[duchessofdulwich]

changing the subject slightly, but what are people views of SAHM who still put their children in nursery?

[helena handbasket]

I think everybody wins. Mum gets a break, and junior gets to socialize and learn a few things.

[budur]

I have a cleaner now once a week and i'm working full time. expecting number 2 any time now and once my relatives would be gone after 2 months intend to have a cleaner twice a week. i agree to previous posts that if you're at home there'll be more mess! haven't asked my hubby though if he will agree!

[Ruth_Baldock]

I agree with HH; also, quite controversially maybe, wouldn't it be a massive shock to a 4/5 y/o who had spent all their time with Mum/other mums and friends to be suddenly in a classroom with 29 other kids?

[Moos]

I just find some of this a bit bizarre. So, if a woman is a SAHM her role in life is to be glued to her children and/or the kitchen floor? Who gets to dictate to a SAHM how she raises her children or run her household? Who gets to judge her if she chooses to sacrifice some other expenditure so that she can save a few hours a week from having to hoover and dust? Is she an unacceptable SAHM if she wants to have a few hours to herself by using part-time childcare? Is it OK to use childcare as long as she does the cleaning in her child-free time? is it OK to use a cleaner as long as she spends the saved time playing with the kids? What if she uses some of that time to read a newspaper or practice the cello? Is that unacceptably selfish?

I think I need to go and lie down.

[Moos]

To be clear, my ranting isn't aimed at any particular poster and I think I might be preaching to the converted anyway.

I'm just astonished that these questions are being asked in the 21st century.

Sorry if this is a major sense of humour bypass and I need to take a Valium or something.

[snowboarder]

I am having similar sense of humour failure about these threads actually - maybe I'm feeling just a bit sensitive - it feels a bit like I need to justify my life choice/the state of my house/my education choices for my children. Blimey. So here it is - my name's snowboarder, I am a SAHM to two children under 26m, I have a cleaner and sometimes (gasp) send out my ironing, and good GRIEF my just 2 yr old goes to a pre school 2 mornings a week so that he can learn to cope with life without me. Phew. And I don't feel guilty about ANY of it. And I'm still totally knackered.