Save Green & Blue! (Lounged)

[Jamma]

To be fair to Celestial when I moved to E Dul a few years ago they were pretty well the only ponceteria in town. Now there's loads but I still find myself going back to Celestial for cards, wrapping paper, tat.

I don't want to see Green and Blue shut down or anything but building this up in to some sort of bitchfight between them and Celestial doesn't seem the way to go about resolving the problem.

As far as I understand it there wasn't a problem, Green and Blues was renovated and there was concrete involved, then there was a problem probably involving concrete. If something looks like a duck and quacks like a duck it probably is a duck

[char1ie]

Goodbye Green and Blue. If the service had been better the first time I went in I may have been in again. As it is, one bad experience is enough to convince me never to go back there.

Celestial is a nice shop, very well stocked with decent gear. And the staff are friendly. And they do not have an attitude problem because you are not familiar with all the bread they stock.

Charlie

[Administrator]

Lounged - as all the facts are not apparent and it is not right to discuss this in the Gossip / issues section. Yet.

[weheartgreenandblue]

-- moved topic --

[Quaywe]

The issue of pipe works, access to them, and who is responsible for their upkeep is a tricky one. I had a similar issue with a sewerage pipe last year in my flat. Our toilet started draining very slowly when it was flushed (and it wasn't the previously nights curry to blame!). A call to our freeholder got the plumber around and he tried to rod the drains without success. Long story short - it got escalated to Thames Water who sent a contractor around. The guy opened the inspection chamber at the rear of the property and it was choc full of raw sewerage. He told us it was blocked about 20m down the pipe.

He then went on to tell me about the areas of responsibility for waste pipes; Thames Water is only responsible for the pipes if they service multiple properties. As he couldn't be sure the pipe in question serviced multiple properties he decided to leave until I could prove it did. Nice. Only sheer persistence got the results we wanted from TW and their idiot contractors. It took almost every neighbour in the street to cooperate through door knocking campaigns for access to their inspection chambers to find the blockage in the shared pipe. Finally they found it and fixed it. Had we not been given access to the adjoining properties it could have literally turned very messy.

The similarity in these stories is that they both involve access to adjacent properties to fix the issue. I'm sure during this whole sage that someone mentioned to me that this was seen as an environmental health issue and the EPA would likely be the next point of call if I didn't get what I wanted. There must be laws around this sort of stuff and allowing access via a neighbouring property to fix issues with your own property. I would expect even more so considering multiple properties are affected. I'm no lawyer so I don't know the specifics, but in a country so densely populated with terraced dwellings I'm surprised that the law hasn't helped G&B and the flats above out a little more swiftly.

Either we're not being told the full story, or the legal system simply isn't equipped to deal with these issues very swiftly. It's a shame Celestial are not being very helpful and that this even needs to be a legal issue. I can see their point in not wanting to lose business however I'd rather allow the access now before this ends up becoming a legal issue and they are forced to allow access during an even busier time - say in a few weeks. There is nothing more important than having good relations with your neighbours.

I wonder if Celestial would agree to allow access if G&B offer to cover Celestial's lost revenue for the days they are affected. I'm sure that cost would be a lot less to G&B than being closed for many weeks. If Celestial doesn't agree on that basis (i.e. with nothing to lose) then I think they're just a bunch of $%^$%*^&'s and they certainly won't be on my Xmas card list.

[dulwichbloke]

Who can say whether G&B have offered compensation? They may have refused to. Also, access is not so simple when it entails drilling/digging up the floor of your shop (then re-laying it) with all the screening off or removal of stock/displays against the unbelievable dust that would create. Then there's the issue of agreeing on the quantum of lost profit and closure of the shop.

The law does indeed provide certain recourse to someone in G&B's position (depending on the facts of course) but it appears that G&B have not commenced proceedings, which suggests to me that they may not have the mreits on their side. Then again, it could be for other reasons, however, given the apparently dire consequences of not getting the matter sorted out, such reticence may not be due to financial reasons. But then again, who knows.

I must say, if someone had stuck an eccentric rant (invoking the power of the Almighty) on a public blog about me, I probably wouldn't take too kindly to it and it would be unlikely to make me more disposed to putting myself out to help them. I have seen so many disputes of this sort go public and involve other neighbours/bystanders and such an approach is almost always counter-productive. I certainly have never seen it improve matters.

I have only had one experience of the owner of G&B and that was not good - she spent the whole time huffing and tutting while bashing on her laptop (composing her latest blog entry no doubt) while she sat next to us at the back of the restaurant. She seemed to be very up-tight about something and was not at all welcoming. However, the food and service were good so we gave the place another go. The next time there was no huffing/tutting owner and the food and service remained good so we will return (assuming it is still open that is!). I hope they get this problem sorted out.

[dulwichmum]

This is simply dreadful. It seems like only yesterday myself, Polly Dorner, Mark, Mockney, Michael Didapopaglopagus, Sean et al and I were quaffing Champers in Green and Blue, and I was actually wearing lingerie from Celestial at the time (Cotton Club) I seem to remember.

Feel the love...

[Michael Palaeologus]

Well DM, at least Terry's DIY is still selling your favourite tipple ...

http://www.surplusandadventure.com/images/product/main/methylated_spirits.jpg

[dulwichmum]

Shame on you Mr Popadopalot! I shall call my lawyers...

[scor46]

char1ie Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Goodbye Green and Blue. If the service had been

> better the first time I went in I may have been in

> again. As it is, one bad experience is enough to

> convince me never to go back there.

>

> Celestial is a nice shop, very well stocked with

> decent gear. And the staff are friendly. And they

> do not have an attitude problem because you are

> not familiar with all the bread they stock.

>

> Charlie

Do you like any of the bars in the area Charlie? Beacuse you seem to whinge about quite a few of them. Maybe the bars are not the problem....

[BJL]

(From my post in the friendly/unfriendly shops thread a week or so ago)

Not favourite:

The guy who owns(?) that gift shop next to Dulwich DIY

So it's called Celestial, then?

Never thought much of him when he used to peddle his crockery seconds at the Christmas craft fair...

[puzzled]

I found the rant posted on the green and blue website rather hysterical and I see it has now been deleted by them. I don't have legal training, but it did seem very libellous. admin here might be well advised to follow suit.

like the other person below I went to celestial to ask for an explanation. it seems the whole thing has been going on for months. celestial say that back in august they allowed g&b's landlord to dig up their yard and that weeks ago they agreed that drain experts could dig through from the yard under the shop and take care of the blockage. this work will begin on tuesday next. one thing they wouldn't do was allow the shop to be dug up because it wasn't necessary

the young woman beind the counter was friendly and very willing to answer my questions. maybe others on here should not be so quick to jump to conclusions.

no one wants any shops in the lovely lane to suffer.

[Administrator]

Thank you for pointing out the removal of the text on the original site puzzled, I have now removed it from the posting on this site too

regards

[Keef]

I'm with Celestial, it sounds like they're being as reasonable as they could be, and if someone asked me to (even partially) close my business during the run up to xmas I'd tell them where to go. I'm not against G&B, and don't want them to close down or anything, and it's a shame they're having this misfortune, but why should their neighbors share it?

[monica]

Apparantly Celestial have granted access i just spoke to G&B and it looks like its all worked out in everyones favour