Ignoring lockdown in ED

[keano77]

Ok, here?s an easy one.

You need to post some packages at the post office on Lordship Lane and want to pick up a few bits at the M&S foodhall. The packages are bulky and would be awkward to take shopping so better to post them first. How do I get to M&S when I leave the post office using the walk on the left system? (No Ubers allowed)

[yeknomyeknom]

I?m not suggesting it?s a good idea, but how you would do it is - leave the PO turning left, down to the co op zebra crossing, then walk back up towards Superdrug and cross back over the zebra onto M&S.

keano77 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Ok, here?s an easy one.

>

> You need to post some packages at the post office

> on Lordship Lane and want to pick up a few bits at

> the M&S foodhall. The packages are bulky and would

> be awkward to take shopping so better to post them

> first. How do I get to M&S when I leave the post

> office using the walk on the left system? (No

> Ubers allowed)

[keano77]

Yes.

But then how would zebra crossings work? As I cross the road I can only turn right, as can the person crossing from the other side. So it would make sense to move to the right-hand side of the pavement and to cross zebra crossings on the right-hand side (with appropriate distancing on wider zebras) so people aren?t getting in each other?s way in case they pass in front of each other.

[seenbeen]

keano77 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Ok, here?s an easy one.

>

> You need to post some packages at the post office

> on Lordship Lane and want to pick up a few bits at

> the M&S foodhall. The packages are bulky and would

> be awkward to take shopping so better to post them

> first. How do I get to M&S when I leave the post

> office using the walk on the left system? (No

> Ubers allowed)

That explains the queues everywhere- picking up a few bits...so if everyone is doing that every day then no wonder the queues are round the block...I have been getting one big shop for 4 people (2 vulnerables) once every 10 days.

[alice]

The simple solution is to not go to lordship lane.

Alternatively pick one shop you cannot live without and approach it via its closest side road.

[Plough Man]

Penguin68 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I'm not sure what the solution is... so, I'm

> curious to hear other peoples' ideas, as I'm a

> full-time pedestrian and can't get anywhere

> (including to buy food) unless I walk... which is

> a nightmare.

>

> One simple solution to suburban pavement use would

> be to make pavements one-way - that is that

> progress along any one pavement would all be in

> the same direction (so no need to dodge out of the

> way of incoming traffic). If you always walked so

> that the houses were on your left that would

> achieve this - you would actually be walking on

> the same side of the street as cars drive - so for

> drivers this would come naturally. Only if you

> needed to overtake would you then have to move

> into the road to do so. More difficult to do on

> shopping streets, of course, where the location of

> the shop (that you need) is key - but you could

> cross the road when you need to, I suppose.

I suggested this a couple of weeks ago...??..

https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?20,2109366

https://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?32,2103350,2109376#msg-2109376

Contacted James McCash about it also,

[woodland]

seenbeen Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> keano77 Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Ok, here?s an easy one.

> >

> > You need to post some packages at the post

> office

> > on Lordship Lane and want to pick up a few bits

> at

> > the M&S foodhall. The packages are bulky and

> would

> > be awkward to take shopping so better to post

> them

> > first. How do I get to M&S when I leave the

> post

> > office using the walk on the left system? (No

> > Ubers allowed)

>

> That explains the queues everywhere- picking up a

> few bits...so if everyone is doing that every day

> then no wonder the queues are round the block...I

> have been getting one big shop for 4 people (2

> vulnerables) once every 10 days.

Agreed - we go to one supermarket every 8 days with one visit to a very local corner shop for Milk top up a week. I have parcels I need to post, but I am going to wait until after the lockdown (they are ebay sales and the people who have bought them have been lovely about waiting). I realise that some people are still running businesses and need to use the post office, so staying away when it isn't urgent seem the best decision for me.

I suppose we each do what we think is the right thing. For me, that means being outside as little as possible and making as little contact with people outside our home.

[Ashlar]

I think having a one way system for walkers is a good idea, but the Highway Code suggests the opposite. You are safest if you are walking towards oncoming traffic as you can see the cars coming. That way if you want to overtake a slower walker you can step into the road easier as you can see what?s coming. So effectively you walk facing the traffic with houses to your right.

[seenbeen]

Ashlar Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I think having a one way system for walkers is a

> good idea, but the Highway Code suggests the

> opposite. You are safest if you are walking

> towards oncoming traffic as you can see the cars

> coming. That way if you want to overtake a slower

> walker you can step into the road easier as you

> can see what?s coming. So effectively you walk

> facing the traffic with houses to your right.

Anyone who walks in the countryside where there is no pavement knows this. The problem we have is that there are pushchairs, kids on scooters, bikes and even adults on bikes, on the pavement. Then there are more cars on the road recently, bikes on the road and then joggers going both ways on the pavement- so if you need to nip in the road to avoid the aforementioned- because 9 times out of 10 they will not shift for you - you are taking your life in your hands....people walking hand in hand are a problem too.

[NewWave]

seenbeen Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Ashlar Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > I think having a one way system for walkers is

> a

> > good idea, but the Highway Code suggests the

> > opposite. You are safest if you are walking

> > towards oncoming traffic as you can see the

> cars

> > coming. That way if you want to overtake a

> slower

> > walker you can step into the road easier as you

> > can see what?s coming. So effectively you walk

> > facing the traffic with houses to your right.

>

> Anyone who walks in the countryside where there is

> no pavement knows this. The problem we have is

> that there are pushchairs, kids on scooters, bikes

> and even adults on bikes, on the pavement. Then

> there are more cars on the road recently, bikes on

> the road and then joggers going both ways on the

> pavement- so if you need to nip in the road to

> avoid the aforementioned- because 9 times out of

> 10 they will not shift for you - you are taking

> your life in your hands....people walking hand in

> hand are a problem too.

yup totally agree

[Penguin68]

but the Highway Code suggests the opposite. You are safest if you are walking towards oncoming traffic as you can see the cars coming.

The Highway Code is specifically talking here about those walking on (rural) roads, not on suburban pavements - on which it is entirely silent. If you are walking on roads then walking towards and on the same side as oncoming traffic ensures that you see it coming and can step onto the verge if necessary (and they may also be more likely to see you). Wholly irrelevant if you have a pavement to walk on, as cars are generally discouraged from mounting these.

[malumbu]

And remember if you are walking in the dark, where something bright/reflective or carry a rolled up newspaper. Sadly I can't find the public information film from 50 years ago advising this. But here is a nice bit of advice about Covid-19 from Living Streets

https://www.livingstreets.org.uk/news-and-blog/blog/coronavirus-walking-the-right-way

[Earl Aelfheah]

The pavements don't allow for people to walk down the street maintaining a safe 2 metre distance from one another. Most cities have extended pavements and also introduced temporary bike lanes to help people to get about. London is one of the few large cities not to have done so.

[Plough Man]

Penguin68 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> but the Highway Code suggests the opposite. You

> are safest if you are walking towards oncoming

> traffic as you can see the cars coming.

>

> The Highway Code is specifically talking here

> about those walking on (rural) roads, not on

> suburban pavements - on which it is entirely

> silent. If you are walking on roads then walking

> towards and on the same side as oncoming traffic

> ensures that you see it coming and can step onto

> the verge if necessary (and they may also be more

> likely to see you). Wholly irrelevant if you have

> a pavement to walk on, as cars are generally

> discouraged from mounting these.

Have to disagree about not being relevant where pavements are available because of another safety consideration.

Pedestrians are much more vulnerable to attackers/abductors/muggers/snatchers who approach in a car from behind on the same side of the road as you. If you are facing the oncoming cars, you can be much more aware of what is happening or likely to happen and take evasive action such as running past the car because the car is unlikely to reverse against the flow of traffic

It's all about minimising risks.

[Penguin68]

Pedestrians are much more vulnerable to attackers/abductors/muggers/snatchers who approach in a car from behind on the same side of the road as you. If you are facing the oncoming cars, you can be much more aware of what is happening or likely to happen and take evasive action such as running past the car because the car is unlikely to reverse against the flow of traffic

1. I was talking about and responding to what's actually in the Highway Code

2. If you walk on the inside of the pavement (nearest the houses) you are far less likely to be attacked (you can't readily be reached from a passing car or bike) - and if you are not visibly on your mobile phone or swinging your handbag similarly. Most suburban streets are sufficiently parked up that these cars additionally act as a barrier.

3. Suburban streets, particularly at the moment, are surprisingly traffic free - so the option of 'backing up', were that a sensible suggestion, is far more available to criminals than on a busy urban or shopping street.

[seenbeen]

Penguin68 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Pedestrians are much more vulnerable to

> attackers/abductors/muggers/snatchers who approach

> in a car from behind on the same side of the road

> as you. If you are facing the oncoming cars, you

> can be much more aware of what is happening or

> likely to happen and take evasive action such as

> running past the car because the car is unlikely

> to reverse against the flow of traffic

>

> 1. I was talking about and responding to what's

> actually in the Highway Code

>

> 2. If you walk on the inside of the pavement

> (nearest the houses) you are far less likely to be

> attacked (you can't readily be reached from a

> passing car or bike) - and if you are not visibly

> on your mobile phone or swinging your handbag

> similarly. Most suburban streets are sufficiently

> parked up that these cars additionally act as a

> barrier.

>

> 3. Suburban streets, particularly at the moment,

> are surprisingly traffic free - so the option of

> 'backing up', were that a sensible suggestion, is

> far more available to criminals than on a busy

> urban or shopping street.

If I'm out for my hour of exercise I do not take anything except house keys and hand gel. The problem is nipping into the road out of the way of the multiple obstructions on the pavements- in these unprecedented times-

[achoo]

I went for a quick walk around the Horniman Gardens and I saw numerous people sat on blankets with picnics and drinks, tanning in the sun..... yes you are not near anyone but thats because everyone else is at home.

I find it extremely selfish as not everyone has an outdoor space and would love to do the same.

[Cyclemonkey]

Tanning in the sun? Not in the last couple of days you didn't it's been cold and peeing it down with rain.

Why is it selfish to use a public open space responsibly? Surely if you were there to observe these "selfish people" daring to use a public space you were also using it?

[Penguin68]

The government is urging people in lock-down to take Vitamin D supplements - yet the police (and the mavens) are cracking down on those sunbathing (when otherwise socially distanced). I am one of the lucky ones with a garden to sit out in, and I don't object to solitary individuals sunning themselves outside. Chances, in this weather, would be a fine thing. If we can get social distancing right (we're getting better, but still as I'm pounded past by joggers almost brushing me unless I leap out of the way - not that good - but most joggers are now far better at making detours round walkers) - then more people could be out more of the time.

[edcam]

Because it's against the rules and as the poster said, many don't have their own outside space but are able to abide by the rules.

It's as if these people think they're special and don't have to do what everyone else does (like the ignorant faction among the joggers.) Their mentality (plus weak lockdown enforcement) is one of the reasons we have such horrific numbers now compared to the rest of Europe.

Cyclemonkey Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Why is it selfish to use a public open space

> responsibly? Surely if you were there to observe

> these "selfish people" daring to use a public

> space you were also using it?

[KidKruger]

what edcam said.

[Blah Blah]

I would also recommend SAD lamps to those for whom lack of sunlight affects mood.

[malumbu]

I suppose one good thing that has come out of this is that joggers are now public enemy #1 and no longer cyclists.....

[malumbu]

And sunbathers may also have crept ahead of cyclists, who will rise up the ranks next?

[Cyclemonkey]

I am a person with no outdoor space and I am fine with people using public spaces in a responsible way.