Lordship lane Co-op wants to open 23/7

[jonsuissy]

We've just got a letter through the door (from whom I do not know) saying the Coop are applying for 24 hour alcohol license and to look on here for further info.

Whoever sent this needs to get their facts correct.

[Bic Basher]

Sainsburys probably closed as they weren't getting the passing trade from a residential part of ED, although they continue to open until midnight. The Co-Op on the other hand would increase the choice available to local residents and users of the bars and restaurants.

I don't live down that part of LL, if the noise particularly on a Friday and Saturday night is already an issue, the opening of a supermarket won't make any difference.

I'd support the Co-op's extension to their licence if they put up signs ensuring customers are mindful of local residents with their noise as the pubs currently do and either pick up the rubbish left behind or contribute to the council cleaning their section of the road.

[Goose]

Correct me if I am wrong ... but the main point of this is the application for a 24 hour alcohol licence. Whilst I can understand the benefit of Co-op staying open for longer hours for general shopping, I completely fail to see the benefit of being able to buy alcohol at 3am. Lordship Lane is busy enough on a Friday/ Saturday night now ... do we really want everyone coming out of the pubs and being able to buy more alcohol. It seems to me Co-op are just hoping to cash in on alcohol sales.

So I object to the proposal for alcohol sales but would welcome longer opening hours for general shopping.

PS James - I live within 100 metres.

[Michael Palaeologus]

I thought that the whole point was that they could trade for 24hrs, the 24hr alcohol thing has been debunked a few posts ago.

Clearly the Coop think that there are enough night workers, insomniacs and late night revellers with the munchies to justify staying open all night. This does not mean their main focus is selling cans of Carlsberg Extra to the befuddled.

The alcohol thing seems to have been created to frighten the masses and allow local populist Politicians to ride to the rescue.

[Lord Danny Poppins]

Co-Op is an over priced, under quality peddling abomination. 24hr. No. 0hr. YES!

[Jeremy]

I agree with Mikey P, it sounds like some people are just using the alcohol argument to scare-monger.

[MissKing]

I'd be happy if it was open late!

[fishbiscuits]

"pasta n sauce" already sounds like abnormally healthy post-pub food.

[Sue]

Goose Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Correct me if I am wrong ... but the main point of

> this is the application for a 24 hour alcohol

> licence.

xxxxxx

Yes you are wrong.

The application is NOT for a 24 hour alcohol licence.

And now this rumour has been started, people will be opposing the application on completely false grounds.

Forgive me for being cynical, but was that the intention of posting false information on here?

ETA: I don't mean you, Goose.

ETA: James Barber, I think you should post on here apologising for giving incorrect information and making absolutely clear - again, since it seems some people have not read the whole thread or looked at your attached pdf - what the Co-Op's application actually says.

If you don't do that, then I - and I expect others - will draw our own conclusions.

[puzzled]

have we all forgotten the very high jobless figures. longer shopping hours means more jobs or at least more money for those already there. simples!

[Goose]

So from this website (below) for application lodged on 27th Feb, open 24 hours but alcohol 0600-2300 (except Sunday).

Has my support but what defines 'late night refreshment'

From: http://app.southwark.gov.uk/licensing/LicPremisesAppliedDetails.asp?systemkey=840448

Operating schedule which accompanied the application form

Expected number of people to attend if more than 5000: Not Applicable

Opening hours: Monday 24hrs. Tuesday 24hrs. Wednesday 24hrs. Thursday 24hrs. Friday 24hrs. Saturday 24hrs. Sunday 24hrs.

Proposed licensable activities (if application relates to conversion of a justices or entertainment licence prior to 7 February 2005 these are the existing licensable activities):

Late night refreshment - indoors:

Monday 23:00 to 05:00

Tuesday 23:00 to 05:00

Wednesday 23:00 to 05:00

Thursday 23:00 to 05:00

Friday 23:00 to 05:00

Saturday 23:00 to 05:00

Sunday 23:00 to 05:00

Sale by retail of alcohol to be consumed off premises:

Monday 06:00 to 23:00

Tuesday 06:00 to 23:00

Wednesday 06:00 to 23:00

Thursday 06:00 to 23:00

Friday 06:00 to 23:00

Saturday 06:00 to 23:00

Sunday 10:00 to 22:30

[Sue]

"Late night refreshment" is stuff like tea and coffee.

[*Bob*]

Wasn't there some other place on Lordship Lane that famously sold 'late night refreshments'?

Don't think it was tea and coffee though.

[Michael Palaeologus]

Maybe they are going to have a little cafe franchise in the shop?

[nowittyname]

In favour of the Co-op being open 24/7 - I believe it is now the only place in East Dulwich, or on Lordship Lane anyway that charges keys for key meters for electricity, gas (and water?) - that's as far as I know - some time ago I gave a lift to a young woman with a toddler whose husband was being kept in Kings, having managed to knock himself out with a moving box as they were moving in.

She had got back late, and couldn't find anywhere along Lordship Lane to charge their meter key (house dark and cold) - had to take her to Peckham Road, the nearest place she could do this - located on the bit that is not the most reassuring place to be for a woman at night. Apparently the Texaco garage at Goose Green and the Costcutter used to do it but stopped, and apparently the Co-op is the only place that still has the social awareness and sense of caring to do this. It's not a money-spinner, so good for them.

[LadyDeliah]

I've emailed my support for the Co-op. Long and varying hours make it difficult for me to shop. If they did online deliveries though, I'd be even happier!

[Bic Basher]

nowittyname Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> In favour of the Co-op being open 24/7 - I believe

> it is now the only place in East Dulwich, or on

> Lordship Lane anyway that charges keys for key

> meters for electricity, gas (and water?) - that's

> as far as I know - some time ago I gave a lift to

> a young woman with a toddler whose husband was

> being kept in Kings, having managed to knock

> himself out with a moving box as they were moving

> in.

>

> She had got back late, and couldn't find anywhere

> along Lordship Lane to charge their meter key

> (house dark and cold) - had to take her to Peckham

> Road, the nearest place she could do this -

> located on the bit that is not the most reassuring

> place to be for a woman at night. Apparently the

> Texaco garage at Goose Green and the Costcutter

> used to do it but stopped, and apparently the

> Co-op is the only place that still has the social

> awareness and sense of caring to do this. It's

> not a money-spinner, so good for them.

Londis which is also 24/7 is a Paypoint retailer as far as I know.

[polla2256]

Will the current staff be offered the option of working the different hours or just have to cope with a re-roster ?

On one hand yes it can be good for the consumer, however the impact on the workers and their families should be taken into account to enable such changes before rushing them through. Okay now the argument of at least they have a job bla bla, well if their job changes to such an extent they should have their rights protected.

Any opinions on this ?

I would also like to extent this idea into the thought that extended Sunday hours should be rolled out accross the high street - There is a social impact that should not be disregared.

[Worker]

There are employment laws in place to protect the workers. You're going deep when you consider the effect on workers of a single store's request to extend opening hours.

[Penguin68]

The Co-op is applying for these extensions not (necessarily) because they wish and desire to use them to their limits, but to give them the opportunity to market-test extended opening - if the customers want it, they will keep it, if they don't, they will revert to current practice - Sainsbury's in DKH could have opened 24/7 Monday-Saturday - tried it and found it wasn't economic. If their only late night customer base is roaring disruptive drunks (normally costing more than they're worth to serve) - which appears to be a fear in this thread, then they probably won't bother.

If they can get existing staff to work longer hours they will, if they can't they will have to employ other people or raise wages.

In the long run the market works as a very efficient system (if you put in some safeguards, very much as back-stops) - trying to second guess it with social engineering or command economy tactics normally is ineffective, and frequently has unintended consequences.

[fredricketts]

Make Mr Barber Right.

I would like to object to the granting of a 24 hour licence to the co-op at Lordship Lane SE22 for the following reasons:

1. We already have too many outlets for 24 hour Intoxicating liquor licensing in Lordship Lane.

2 The binge drinking and drunks in lordship lane every night has increased tenfold in the last 6 years, owing to the Government and Council policies, allowing night clubs and pubs to extend their drinking hours till the early hours of the morning, in residential areas, most of the time causing a nuisance to local residents.

3. We already have a parking problem at the end of Ashbourne Grove during the day time, and this is gradually getting worse of a night time, due to the clubs and pubs having extended hours, and to add, another outlet, all night will attract more cars and drunks to the area, causing more pollution and trouble to the area.

I thought the council and the Government wanted to cut down on people binge drinking, yet now you are saying, you can drink twenty four seven. We will help you drink more by allowing twenty four seven drinking outlets.

Really don?t make sense. You are, by allowing this, encouraging binge drinking, all day and night.

Along with, ruining resident?s good way of life that they have enjoyed for years. I for one know that the area of Dulwich that I live in has slowly been deteriorating, through bad governments and councils changes to making profits and putting businesses profits in front of residents who have paid good money for their properties in order to live a nice peaceful life in a good environments?. That you are now destroying.

[polla2256]

Worker Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> There are employment laws in place to protect the

> workers. You're going deep when you consider the

> effect on workers of a single store's request to

> extend opening hours.

Yes there are workers rights and employment laws but a wider impact on our society at large must be taken into account. It's becoming common place for such shops to open these kind of hours.

Many parts of central europe still have no opening on Sundays, 9-5 normal hours and are all the better for it - There aappears to be far less social disruption. I'm no expect on this matter nor an ecomnomist but we must take stock of our community and how we want it.

It's not just this co-op but all co-ops, tescos, sainsburys, house of fraisers, debenhams, spar .... the list is endless.

The end game for us is a 24/7 society with no ownership of our social environment.

The affect on staff is just my argument - there are many others.

[fredricketts]

One hundred per cent right.

But a wider impact on our society at large must be taken into account

[camberwell70]

Where is there a 24hr House of Fraser?

[Jeremy]

Yeah, right on. In fact, I suggest that shops should only be allowed to between 10am and 1pm.

And on the Sabbath, such things should be totally prohibited as we should be dedicating ourselves to thanking the Lord (for he hath given us fish fingers and Haagen Dazs ice cream).

Or we could join the 21st century.