Jump to content

Recommended Posts

StraferJack Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Bossman may be the single thing that shifts me

> away from lifelong lager drinking

>

> I'm only on the pale ale type stuff but I know the

> line has been crossed



It's a gateway drink as a wise bird told me. You'll be on Fudgeries, old Kneewhacker and sporting a non-ironic beard by October. Actually I like most craft beer but they are not 'live'. In the pub I drink real beer at home the old wifebasher at 5.2% does the trick*


*note Stella in the supermarkets is weaker 4.8 so therefore tastes crap like all weak lagers (well, let's be honest almost all lagers)

I went to the Rake in Borough Market recently. Ironic and non-ironic beards in harmony over fantastic beer. I'm not bothered about specifically 'craft' beer, just good beer, and it is noticeable that even big breweries are producing better stuff, and pubs are stocking a wider range.


BTW does anybody know why the Draft House only has one bitter on draft? It's always seemed odd to me.

The other factor is that pubs have re-learnt how to look after proper beer again. In the 80s and 90s the art (certainly in London) was almost lost, so even when you did have a real ale it was often off becuase not enough people were drinking it and it wasn't getting the care and attention it needed from many guvnors. Now, i know I can more or less rely on most (many) pubs to serve a decent ale so I rarely drink lager out of the home now*


*exceptions being when it's very hot, i'm very pissed or the pub's a craphole

DaveR Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I went to the Rake in Borough Market recently.

> Ironic and non-ironic beards in harmony over

> fantastic beer. I'm not bothered about

> specifically 'craft' beer, just good beer, and it

> is noticeable that even big breweries are

> producing better stuff, and pubs are stocking a

> wider range.

>



Love The Rake bar - used to buy from the UtoBeer boys in the mkt when I lived up that way. Good beer, good choice.

DaveR Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I went to the Rake in Borough Market recently.

> Ironic and non-ironic beards in harmony over

> fantastic beer. I'm not bothered about

> specifically 'craft' beer, just good beer, and it

> is noticeable that even big breweries are

> producing better stuff, and pubs are stocking a

> wider range.

>

> BTW does anybody know why the Draft House only has

> one bitter on draft? It's always seemed odd to

> me.


*group hug*

oh wow thank you to everyone for fab suggestions and replies! lots to check out. yes, I have been to Boss Man, great selection there and a real asset to LL.


daveR - yep the rake bar is a fave of mine too. never manage to get a seat inside but like all good pubs, you never have to wait that long to get served, no matter how packed the bar area is.


am particularly interested to find out more about london microbreweries so cheers for that netts and voyageur, place in crystal palace sounds fab as does kernel brewery.


I find I have to search out nice delis/specialist vintners to pick up local beers/microbrewery beers altho supermarkets sell more choices nowadays. maybe i am a sucker for nice packaging & labels dulwichfox!! I think I want to grow my own hops, go on a mashing course and sell beer for the rest of my life...:))


PS oooooh i loved Louisa on the street food thread, its all fun stuff. we can still appreciate street food, no? good debate was had.

El Pibe Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> That's a bit unfair DF.

> Craft Beer is all about experimentation and

> breaking with accepted traditions.

> Like anything some of it works some of it doesn't,

> but the world's a better place for the trying.

>

> Else we'd all be eating jellied eels and...oh

> wrong thread ;)


Come on Pib's


You know what D "Jack Dee of the forum" F is ALL about.


Take anything "fun" and he'll put a knitting needle down the jap's eye of it.

  • 2 weeks later...

Hey All


This is David the new manager of The Draft House, got some fantastic beers coming up soon as we are running a Hop the Pond promo. There will be a massive range of American crafts including some really special rare one offs! as far as my cask selection I am looking at all of the marvellous (very) local brewers we have on our doorstep and will be showcasing the best London ales out there!


Coming on in the next couple of days is a Brooklyn dry Irish stout (its amazing)and Sierra Nevada Ruthless Rye a big bold pale ale.


In Cask I have Clarence and Fredericks Golden and their IPA, Sambrooks Wandle, Pin Up, and Tommy (brewed in Herne Hill)


One of the plans I am looking to put into play is to enlist you guys in choosing what I stock! If you have any favourites let me know and I will get them shortlisted, then will get them up on a board in the bar so that you can vote for what's being served on the bar.


See you at the bar



Dave

In the draft house a couple of weeks ago i Got given a Golden Draak as a recommendation (not on menu, so didn't see price until girl opened it and put it in the till)--- delicious beer....?8.95 a bottle. Three days later had exactly the same in belgo, Covent garden for ?5.50.


Outrageous rip off in the draft house

StraferJack Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Bossman may be the single thing that shifts me

> away from lifelong lager drinking

>

> I'm only on the pale ale type stuff but I know the

> line has been crossed


bossman - shit name but wonderful slection of beers.

Interesting article on the use of the word 'craft' by the beer industry http://www.londonlovesbusiness.com/business-news/business/browns-beer-big-beer-brands-stop-pretending-you-were-crafted-by-a-guy-in-a-shed/4949.article


titch oh no that's not good. was it def the same beer, seems a hell of a lot more to pay for it in ED than Covent Garden?


I spent 4.50 on a bottle of N2B black widow stout and 3.95 on their IPA. expensive habit but suppose it forces you to drink less... I'd only have spent it on wine otherwise. http://www.norfolksquarebrewery.co.uk/#!maverikbeers/c200s Didn't like the porter at all.

Yes, definitely same beer. The draft house manager sent me a nice pm apologising for not being made aware of the price until the bottle had been opened and explaining that as Belgo are Belgian beer specialists they get a big bulk discount. He also offered to buy me a beer next time I'm passing.


numbers Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Interesting article on the use of the word 'craft'

> by the beer industry

> http://www.londonlovesbusiness.com/business-news/b

> usiness/browns-beer-big-beer-brands-stop-pretendin

> g-you-were-crafted-by-a-guy-in-a-shed/4949.article

>

>

> titch oh no that's not good. was it def the same

> beer, seems a hell of a lot more to pay for it in

> ED than Covent Garden?

>

> I spent 4.50 on a bottle of N2B black widow stout

> and 3.95 on their IPA. expensive habit but suppose

> it forces you to drink less... I'd only have spent

> it on wine otherwise.

> http://www.norfolksquarebrewery.co.uk/#!maverikbee

> rs/c200s Didn't like the porter at all.

numbers - the word "craft" is definitely overused, such as the two examples given in the article of Goose Island and Blue Moon. I always just thought "craft beer" was the American equivalent of "microbrew"... another term which seems a little misleading when brands like Meantime and Brewdog are starting to appear all over the place. But at the end of the day, if the beer tastes good I'll still buy it.

I think the trend started with small scale producers in the US, but I think these days the term really just covers anything that isn't coors, bud et al.


I think there's an element of an intentioanl break with traditional beer methods and a lot more experimentation, something that has really begun to take off over here to, with, as I said, mixed results.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Latest Discussions

    • The is very low water pressure in the middle of Friern Road this morning.
    • I think mostly those are related to the same "issues". In my experience, it's difficult using the pin when reporting problems, especially if you're on a mobile... There's two obvious leaks in that stretch and has been for sometime one of them apparently being sewer flooding 😱  
    • BBC Homepage Skip to content Accessibility Help EFor you Notifications More menu Search BBC                     BBC News Menu   UK England N. Ireland Scotland Alba Wales Cymru Isle of Man Guernsey Jersey Local News Vets under corporate pressure to increase revenue, BBC told   Image source,Getty Images ByRichard Bilton, BBC Panorama and Ben Milne, BBC News Published 2 hours ago Vets have told BBC Panorama they feel under increasing pressure to make money for the big companies that employ them - and worry about the costly financial impact on pet owners. Prices charged by UK vets rose by 63% between 2016 and 2023, external, and the government's competition regulator has questioned whether the pet-care market - as it stands - is giving customers value for money. One anonymous vet, who works for the UK's largest vet care provider, IVC Evidensia, said that the company has introduced a new monitoring system that could encourage vets to offer pet owners costly tests and treatment options. A spokesperson for IVC told Panorama: "The group's vets and vet nurses never prioritise revenue or transaction value over and above the welfare of the animal in their care." More than half of all UK households are thought to own a pet, external. Over the past few months, hundreds of pet owners have contacted BBC Your Voice with concerns about vet bills. One person said they had paid £5,600 for 18 hours of vet-care for their pet: "I would have paid anything to save him but felt afterwards we had been taken advantage of." Another described how their dog had undergone numerous blood tests and scans: "At the end of the treatment we were none the wiser about her illness and we were presented with a bill of £13,000."   Image caption, UK pet owners spent £6.3bn on vet and other pet-care services in 2024, according to the CMA Mounting concerns over whether pet owners are receiving a fair deal prompted a formal investigation by government watchdog, the Competition and Markets Authority (CMA). In a provisional report, external at the end of last year, it identified several issues: Whether vet companies are being transparent about the ownership of individual practices and whether pet owners have enough information about pricing The concentration of vet practices and clinics in the hands of six companies - these now control 60% of the UK's pet-care market Whether this concentration has led to less market competition and allowed some vet care companies to make excess profits 'Hitting targets' A vet, who leads one of IVC's surgeries (and who does not want to be identified because they fear they could lose their job), has shared a new internal document with Panorama. The document uses a colour code to compare the company's UK-wide tests and treatment options and states that it is intended to help staff improve clinical care. It lists key performance indicators in categories that include average sales per patient, X-rays, ultrasound and lab tests. The vet is worried about the new policy: "We will have meetings every month, where one of the area teams will ask you how many blood tests, X-rays and ultrasounds you're doing." If a category is marked in green on the chart, the clinic would be judged to be among the company's top 25% of achievers in the UK. A red mark, on the other hand, would mean the clinic was in the bottom 25%. If this happens, the vet says, it might be asked to come up with a plan of action. The vet says this would create pressure to "upsell" services. Panorama: Why are vet bills so high? Are people being priced out of pet ownership by soaring bills? Watch on BBC iPlayer now or BBC One at 20:00 on Monday 12 January (22:40 in Northern Ireland) Watch on iPlayer For instance, the vet says, under the new model, IVC would prefer any animal with suspected osteoarthritis to potentially be X-rayed. With sedation, that could add £700 to a bill. While X-rays are sometimes necessary, the vet says, the signs of osteoarthritis - the thickening of joints, for instance - could be obvious to an experienced vet, who might prefer to prescribe a less expensive anti-inflammatory treatment. "Vets shouldn't have pressure to do an X-ray because it would play into whether they are getting green on the care framework for their clinic." IVC has told Panorama it is extremely proud of the work its clinical teams do and the data it collects is to "identify and close gaps in care for our patients". It says its vets have "clinical independence", and that prioritising revenue over care would be against the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons' (RCVS) code and IVC policy. Vets say they are under pressure to bring in more money per pet   Published 15 April 2025 Vets should be made to publish prices, watchdog says   Published 15 October 2025 The vet says a drive to increase revenue is undermining his profession. Panorama spoke to more than 30 vets in total who are currently working, or have worked, for some of the large veterinary groups. One recalls being told that not enough blood tests were being taken: "We were pushed to do more. I hated opening emails." Another says that when their small practice was sold to a large company, "it was crazy... It was all about hitting targets". Not all the big companies set targets or monitor staff in this way. The high cost of treatment UK pet owners spent £6.3bn on vet and other pet-care services in 2024 - equal to just over £365 per pet-owning household, according to the CMA. However, most pet owners in the UK do not have insurance, and bills can leave less-well-off families feeling helpless when treatment is needed. Many vets used not to display prices and pet owners often had no clear idea of what treatment would cost, but in the past two years that has improved, according to the CMA. Rob Jones has told Panorama that when his family dog, Betty, fell ill during the autumn of 2024 they took her to an emergency treatment centre, Vets Now, and she underwent an operation that cost almost £5,000. Twelve days later, Betty was still unwell, and Rob says he was advised that she could have a serious infection. He was told a diagnosis - and another operation - would cost between £5,000-£8,000.   Image caption, Betty's owners were told an operation on her would cost £12,000 However, on the morning of the operation, Rob was told this price had risen to £12,000. When he complained, he was quoted a new figure - £10,000. "That was the absolute point where I lost faith in them," he says. "It was like, I don't believe that you've got our interests or Betty's interests at heart." The family decided to put Betty to sleep. Rob did not know at the time that both his local vet, and the emergency centre, branded Vets Now, where Betty was treated, were both owned by the same company - IVC. He was happy with the treatment but complained about the sudden price increase and later received an apology from Vets Now. It offered him £3,755.59 as a "goodwill gesture".   Image caption, Rob Jones says he lost faith in the vets treating his pet dog Betty Vets Now told us its staff care passionately for the animals they treat: "In complex cases, prices can vary depending on what the vet discovers during a consultation, during the treatment, and depending on how the patient responds. "We have reviewed our processes and implemented a number of changes to ensure that conversations about pricing are as clear as possible." Value for money? Independent vet practices have been a popular acquisition for corporate investors in recent years, according to Dr David Reader from the University of Glasgow. He has made a detailed study of the industry. Pet care has been seen as attractive, he says, because of the opportunities "to find efficiencies, to consolidate, set up regional hubs, but also to maximise profits". Six large veterinary groups (sometimes referred to as LVGs) now control 60% of the UK pet care market - up from 10% a decade ago, according to the CMA, external. They are: Linnaeus, which owns 180 practices Medivet, which has 363 Vet Partners with 375 practices CVS Group, which has 387 practices Pets at Home, which has 445 practices under the name Vets for Pets IVC Evidensia, which has 900 practices When the CMA announced its provisional findings last autumn, it said there was not enough competition or informed choice in the market. It estimated the combined cost of this to UK pet owners amounted to £900m between 2020-2024. Corporate vets dispute the £900m figure. They say their prices are competitive and made freely available, and reflect their huge investment in the industry, not to mention rising costs, particularly of drugs. The corporate vets also say customers value their services highly and that they comply with the RCVS guidelines.   Image caption, A CMA survey suggests pet owners are happy with the service they receive from vets A CMA survey suggests pet owners are happy with their vets - both corporate and independent - when it comes to quality of service. But, with the exception of Pets at Home, customer satisfaction on cost is much lower for the big companies. "I think that large veterinary corporations, particularly where they're owned by private equity companies, are more concerned about profits than professionals who own veterinary businesses," says Suzy Hudson-Cooke from the British Veterinary Union, which is part of Unite. Proposals for change The CMA's final report on the vet industry is expected by the spring but no date has been set for publication. In its provisional report, it proposed improved transparency on pricing and vet ownership. Companies would have to reveal if vet practices were part of a chain, and whether they had business connections with hospitals, out-of-hours surgeries, online pharmacies and even crematoria. IVC, CVS and Vet Partners all have connected businesses and would have to be more transparent about their services in the future. Pets at Home does not buy practices - it works in partnership with individual vets, as does Medivet. These companies have consistently made clear in their branding who owns their practices. The big companies say they support moves to make the industry more transparent so long as they don't put too high a burden on vets. David Reader says the CMA proposals could have gone further. "There's good reason to think that once this investigation is concluded, some of the larger veterinary groups will continue with their acquisition strategies." The CMA says its proposals would "improve competition by helping pet owners choose the right vet, the right treatment, and the right way to buy medicine - without confusion or unnecessary cost". For Rob Jones, however, it is probably too late. "I honestly wouldn't get another pet," he says. "I think it's so expensive now and the risk financially is so great.             Food Terms of Use About the BBC Privacy Policy Cookies Accessibility Help Parental Guidance Contact the BBC Make an editorial complaint BBC emails for you Copyright © 2026 BBC. The BBC is not responsible for the content of external sites. Read about our approach to external linking.
    • What does the area with the blue dotted lines and the crossed out water drop mean? No water in this area? So many leaks in the area.
Home
Events
Sign In

Sign In



Or sign in with one of these services

Search
×
    Search In
×
×
  • Create New...