Thought 484 bus 'service' couldn't get worse?

[Lee Scoresby]

Wrong. I have posted before about this lousy bus service, 'serving' (LOL) East Dulwich. Overheard last night: Between a driver waiting to start his shift on a 185, and numerous passengers waiting . . . waiting for the 484.

Passengers point out to the driver that the Countdown time for the 484 has read 'DUE' for 20 minutes. And that this happens day after day.

It's very simple, says the driver. The bus company misinforms the Countdown system. So there you have it - for a 4-late-4 you can't even trust the electronic wait time.

The company in question is Abellio, who are Dutch. And you can bet your last guilder they wouldn't DARE mess Dutch travellers round this way back home. But here in London, dozy lazy complacent complicit TfL points one of its 2 blind eyes and waves the situation through. Wake up TfL suits! Put your pension plans down for just one minute and do the regulatory job you've been tasked to do.

Blimey o'reilly

Lee Scoresby

[Alex K]

Whilst I am sympathetic to rant and ranter, I do wonder: Which of the EDF readers is best poised to take your concern forward -- or will that be a matter for another venue?

[ianr]

Was this at the Lewisham terminus?

[Lee Scoresby]

Not ranting Alex K, and I don't need your condescension. Or does dissent bother you, Alex K?

It's anger at a lousy public service. I have said on the EDF before, the more people put up with stuff, the more we'll get dumped on.

This is a FORUM, read the label. In a democracy, people talk together and share knowledge.

Now in fact, mechanisms of accountability and change are extremely imperfect in Britain, not least in local government. If there were an effective 'other venue' I would use it. But I can talk to other SE Londoners about the situation.

ianr, it was Camberwell, coming toward East Dulwich.

[philosophie]

I've noticed this too on the Countdown screens - 484 bus often reads as 'due' several minutes before it actually arrives! I had wondered what was going on...

[aquarius moon]

It only ever happens at the first stops, eg. Camberwell Green & Kings.

I've always got the impression that the buses are due to leave the bus station at Camberwell at a certain time, which gets posted on the countdown board as say 2mins at the first stop, 4 mins at Kings.

Then for some reason, the bus doesn't actually leave the depot when it's supposed to.

Hence, 2 mins becomes 5 etc.

It doesn't usually happen further along the route, once it is known what time the bus has actually started it's run.

This has been going on for ages, so the problem obviously lies with either Camberwell bus depot and/or Abellio & the info they are sending out.

[Lee Scoresby]

Happy to cut Countdown itself a bit of slack - it's ballpark - often the bus comes SOONER than advised - (unlike "adjusting the service", hoho, which just means hangin' about in a stopped bus) - but 'DUE' for 20 minutes? - it destroys trust in the system

It may be 'start of route' - here's something that happens further down the line - just happened to me 90 minutes before writing this - not exactly rush hour: the 484 was chock-a-block, and people waiting at an ED stop were left standing.

My point: this is a chronically badly run route, and TfL has failed over years to stand up for passengers. And as I pointed out to Alex K, there is no obvious way for us to hold the nameless-faceless ones to account and insist on a properly serviced bus route.

Lee Scoresby

[JohnL]

I remember hearing the countdown isn't done on time but on where the bus is (one stop away etc.).

if it's in the station - I can see then why it might say due.

[StraferJack]

Lee was a BIT ranty, but that doesn't mean he is wrong

Some bus routes simply are better run than others. 484 is poor and the 37 oscillates between ok and poor

The bus countdowns for 40/176/185 are near enough reliable

bus countdowns on 37 route, no matter where you are, can be a complete work of fiction. Yesterday at Herne Hill it said 15 mins, then 13, then back to 18, then stayed at 20 mins for a while before eventually counting down to 0 and a bus turned up

On other days it can say 8 minutes, only for a bus to arrive in 2 minutes

This just doesn't happen on other routes and there must be an underlying reason - some routes rely on manual updates maybe?

Anyway - 484. Rubbish. All single decker services in London = rubbish

[TopTree]

Complaint to the Mayor - The buck stops at his office?

[Bic Basher]

Wait for a 197 at Peckham Bus Station where a bus can say 'due' for a long period without leaving the bus station.

[Alex K]

**condescension**?

I addressed you as an equal; no thought of "descending" to a level below mine. If I've triggered a deep-seated flare of self-perceived inadequacy, I do apologise. I have no idea when a poster's psyche harbours an explosive device of that sort, much less when its fuse is live, and certainly I did not mean to set off in you such a flare.

If a complaint is made in a forum none of whose readers can act to resolve the complaint... the falling tree, the forest, no one to hear it, is the tree's noisy complaint acted on? I sympathise with the *non*ranter, then, in his *non*rant, but am at a loss as to what to do beyond extending condolences. TopTree, above, has made a practical suggestion. Let me endorse it: Complain to BoJo.

And **Does dissent bother you...**?

Why should it? I can't follow that train of associations at all.

[Nigello]

Try writing to Val Shawcross at the London Assembly. She is compiling a list of people's thoughts on London's bus service.

[LadyDeliah]

Alex K, whether it was condescending or not, it was rude. If someone wants to discuss an issue with their neigbours then it's pretty crappy telling them they are wasting their time and should go elsewhere.

[Townleygreen]

It might be worth putting in a complaint to tfl - they have a team dealing with bus complaints, the contact is here:

https://custserv.tfl.gov.uk/icss_csip/ZCreateRequestChangeAboutValue.do?newTab=CA_12162

A friend used to work on this team, they seemed to try hard to sort complaints out

[Countrlass22]

We had same

we waited 40 minutes for 484 on last Saturday evening most unusual,then of course standing room only.

countrlass22

[Lee Scoresby]

Well Alex K, now we've taken a bite out of each other, shall we leave it? I have no interest whatever in troll-on-troll action.

'Authoritarian personalities' occasionally come on the EDF for whom dissent (speaking about problems) is offensive and threatening. So I'm glad that isn't you.

Thanks for all the suggestions about what to do. I really do not want to seem cynical about any of them. In past years I have engaged with a variety of complaint procedures, not just about transport. Every one of them was just a garbage chute. It was impossible even to get the system to refer to (never mind admit) the issue at hand. Nothing whatever was ever achieved. Transport user groups, in the past at least, have been famously, hilariously unwilling to upset the transport companies they were supposely holding to account.

In this present context, my point to people is really to notice how scattered and temporary and uncertain these suggested remedies are. Feedback (a better idea than 'complaint') should be such an inherent intuitive evident continuous part of any modern urban public system that this sort of forum thread would be superfluous.

Lee Scoresby

[MrsDanvers]

The 484 service has been badly hit in the last few weeks by long-running roadworks in Ladywell that mean there's a weird diversion in operation in Brockley on both directions. I find it's a reasonable service most of the time, but a very busy one. It's a lot better than the train service.

[cle]

Why is there no Countdown system at Vauxhall bus station, for the 185 stop (or for any, I couldn't see it anywhere?)