PCN - worth appealing?

[fatcats]

Just got a PCN through from Southwark council for failing to drive in the direction shown by the arrow on a blue sign. It happened on he Peckham Rye junction, I think we turned right onto East Dulwich Road. The photos on the PCN aren't very clear and we rarely drive around ED anymore having moved a bit further out 3 years ago.

The only blue sign I can see on google street view is just below the traffic lights. It doesn't appear massively visible (and we obviously didn't see it) . Also on this occasion it was dark and the weather was atrocious, really hammering it down.

I know this junction catches people out in various ways, just wondering if there is any point appealing. Would be good to get anyone's thoughts.

[edcam]

If that's the way your turned, on to ED Road then there's no point in appealing. The restrictions there have been clearly signposted for a long time now.

[fatcats]

Ok fair enough, is it just that arrow though or did we miss some other signposting?

The point of my post really is that we didn't see the signposting (possibly because of the weather) so trying to establish what signposting is actually there. We certainly didn't ignore it intentionally,

[Lowlander]

The traffic lights do have a straight on only arrow (white on blue background). Been there at least 5 years. And the road has a one way arrow on it too.

[fatcats]

Yes, in my first post I said that I can see from google street view there is a directional arrow there. Not disputing that. However, we didn't see the arrow at the time, so I am trying to establish how we made this mistake and if there is an issue with visibility of the signposting.

So in order to do this I was trying to find out a) if there is any other signposting - e.g. a no right turn sign or something similar, which might be more visible (I have checked on google streetview and can't see anything) and b) general question really if those straight on arrows can be considered visible enough in poor conditions, as we didn't see it.

Obviously the latter is a subjective point, but wondered if anyone has every appealed on this basis and won, particularly at this junction - certainly not trying to start a proper EDF style debate and it may be a question better suited to a more specific forum.

[Jeremy]

Sorry to hear you got a fine, but I think the combination of the "straight ahead" arrow below the lights, and arrows painted on the road are quite clear. So no point appealing IMO. I'd pay up asap if I were you, and avoid the increased fine.

[Lowlander]

Further back (about 500 yards) there is a junction with a big green sign on the left showing the way to Dulwich/Nunhead

Then there is the straight on only arrow on the traffic light. There are thousands of those around the country, so it's a well established road sign. You'd be challenging on that basis.

Just out of interest how likely is it that you'll make the same mistake again?

[fatcats]

Jeremy Wrote:

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> Sorry to hear you got a fine, but I think the

> combination of the "straight ahead" arrow below

> the lights, and arrows painted on the road are

> quite clear. So no point appealing IMO. I'd pay up

> asap if I were you, and avoid the increased fine.

Ok, just checked google street view again, a bit further back this time, and you're right we managed to miss the white arrow on the road as well. Although the PCN is specifically for the blue sign (according to the letter). But you are right we should pay up. Thanks for the input.

[JohnL]

It is difficult driving around East Dulwich/Peckham until you know the layout.

Sometimes counterintuitive.

[Lowlander]

It's difficult driving anywhere in London. Unusually for me I drove to North London over the weekend, you really have to keep your wits around you with the ever-changing road layouts, nearly got caught out myself a few times.

[DulwichFox]

Even the buses don't turn right there so can't claim to be a 37 bus driver and forgot you weren't driving your bus.

Foxy

[rabbitears]

Not to pile on, but there is also a large "no right or left turn" sign by Kinssle Rd, and all the green lights in the traffic lights are green straight on arrows.

[Markyryan]

Hey Fatcats- recently had a long running dispute over a PCN. Sorry but you are unlikely to have much luck on appeal.

Hope the fine isn't stiff, but you are best to pay it and try not to be to annoyed by it.

[minder]

Fatcats, I would agree with Mark and just pay. Southwark don't want to know your reasons. I still veer towards that direction (turning right onto ED road) as you could do that sometime ago but now you have to turn left (green sign) to go away from where you want to get to!

[fatcats]

Thanks for your input guys, appreciate it.

[trinidad]

i hope you have not paid as yet?

[edcam]

trinidad Wrote:

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> i hope you have not paid as yet?

Why? Do you want them to have to pay the full penalty, rather than the reduced one? How mean.

[trinidad]

Please update us on the status of your ticket asap PLEASE

[micon75]

I got caught at this intersection as I was trying to get to a petrol station before returning a hire car. I remember the navigation aid continually re-routing and we were going in circles and getting frustrated so I probably turned right out of frustration.

Coming from Australia I'm used to seeing a 'no right turn' sign at the intersection so it wasn't obvious to me once I got to the intersection to see a blue up arrow. I can see now I was in the wrong.

As rabbitears identified "...there is also a large "no right or left turn" sign by Kinssle Rd" but perhaps this could be mistaken for a 'no right turn' into Kinssle Rd?

Personally I think it would be more obvious by putting a 'no right turn' sign at the intersection.

Anyway I paid it as I was in the wrong.

[lilolil]

Some time ago, I tried to make a driver who was about to turn right there aware that it was a no right turn and they told me to F** off and stuck their middle finger up at me.

I expect they got a ticket too....

[TheArtfulDogger]

Hopefully including a photo of their crass finger action ... Lol

[peckham_ryu]

The website to check this stuff out at is PePiPoo.

I have appealed two parking fines based on there being technical problems with how they were issued. PePiPoo will help you determine if you have grounds to appeal. Best of luck.