Ko

CWALD, some things you say I agree with. :) Other things you say I don't agree with. :'( You talk about 'skewed perceptions', but how do you know what is motivating each person to sign a petition? What about if someone has a skewed perception which is so skewed the other way? Or if someone has lost a relative/friend to addiction, does that make them more qualified to comment or more skewed in their perceptions? My point is that things aren't so either/or, black or white as some comments above suggest. Many people know/have known addicts and have lost ones they love and have different views on treatments, rehabilitation, approaches etc. I for one want to see a more responsible approach to the whole thing.

I back the petition. Personally, I don?t agree with all the points that other Bara members make. But that?s the way these things work. People who remember my posts will know some of my views. Eg. I don?t agree with people who want CPZs. Or that even where I disagree with the point someone makes, I?m all for consultation, open discussion, people getting to have a say and the proper processes being followed. In my opinion, I suspect some (not all) of the views or thoughts (about not knowing why people want to back the petition) are just as, ?closed-minded?, ?hysterical?, ?sweeping the problem under someone?s else carpet,? ?scaremongering?, ?uninformed?, and ?wanting them away from our lives?. Its not either/or. Some people quickly pass judgement. Let?s pretend that I wanted to pass judgement on some of them or people who are thinking the same thing, I might say as follows. So you don?t like the petition. But how many of you have actually regularly done something responsible, positive and proactive to help drug addicts, actually giving up your free time, and doing it without being paid for any of time? How many of you have campaigned on their behalf? How many of you have actually worked with them face-to-face in sometimes unpleasant conditions, sometimes feeling unsafe? I know some of you have, but I?m guessing some haven?t. How many of you have actually got your hands dirty helping drug addicts? Without being paid to do so? Or taking a lower paid job because you want to help them? Rather than being Nimbys and sitting in your ivory towers ? thinking that you don?t sign such petitions and you pay a few taxes making it the government?s problem. Even if the government isn?t doing a good job. (I'm being devil's advocate here.) Yes, you might NOT be opposed to the proposal like some of the people signing the petition, but have you regularly done something responsible and proactive for drug addicts? Let?s get real. I suspect some people signing the petition can?t answer yes to those questions. But I equally suspect that some of those accusing (or thinking) of others as being close-minded/hysterical/nimbys, also can?t say yes to those questions - because they are too are nimbys busy sitting in their ivory towers and thinking that it is somebody?s else?s problem to deal with (eg government/councils), even if they are not doing a good and responsible job of dealing with it. Everyone can do more, me included. There are other things one could say, but why bother. Its not either/or. I think we need to look at the needs of all sections of the community, including drug addicts, including neighbours, including residents, including local businesses. I think we need to be responsible. I don?t think the PCT?s approach so far has been responsible. Will it become responsible? ? who knows. Previous things they?ve done have not given me much confidence.

Curmudgeon Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Hello > > I'm really sorry I started this thread and was > unable to return due to log-in difficulties. I've > been reading with interest though and have smiled > at some of the more obvious 'mates of the owner' > posts and read with interest the post of the > owner. Which are the mates of the owner posts? Why has the first post been changed to 'anonymous user'. I'm confused. :-S

SeanMacGabhann Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Seems to be a few people who WANT to come but are > slightly intimidated - can I offer some > re-assurance?... > > ...Secondly, despite all the ribbing and > disagreements that you read on the forum, > face-to-face meetings have been nothing but great > fun with everyone dropping their persona and being > their "real" selves (for the most part anyway ;-) > ) Sean - people being their real selves - that sounds even more scary!

Will everyone be nice? What about if I say something someone doesn't agree with - will they get all sarcastic etc??? ;-)

I have signed the petition. I have had an addict in my immediate family. Addicts need help and there are also safety issues to consider and openly discuss. I have volunteered with a homeless charity. A number of those people were addicts. The charity workers and volunteers were there to help them. However safety issues were paramount. Also, the charity's neighbours were considered and any issues were openly talked about, in an attempt to prevent problems before they happened.

Keef, I was thinking about the same programme I think but I can't remember the name either!

Nutty - they're not the only ones though! Within a 2 minute walk of my house, there's houses that have been converted into flats over the last few years. They are also various new build flats, including the new flats going up opposite the CPT. There are also two work vans that regularly park outside my house... There are just too many vehicles.

I used to love Jamie And His Magic Torch - great helterskelter. Music is pure 70s! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-B_FQKHQDYk&mode=related&search= Cockleshell Bay was a lunchtime favourite http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMX47NId3a8 Out of the various US programmes I remember Diff'rent Strokes http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmfH1RsxWEc

I think I read somewhere that the requirement of parking facilities only applies if a certain number of houses/flats are built. There are 2 new builds opposite us and they have no parking and they have no frontage on our road (they're reached via an alleyway) - so their vehicles are additional to what is already on the road.

Damo Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Good luck to ESPH, a welcome addition to LL. Not > an estate agent or kithcenware shop and renovating > a derelict building whilst offering a unique > service to the locale. Ignore the boo boys. > > (Great to see the forum tradition of putting the > boot in is alive and kicking, literally. If a > "premium" gym isn't your thing, don't worry about > it or the welfare of those who may be interested. > Or wait until its opened and you've seen what's on > offer, it may be actually reasonable value? > Mini-rant over :))) Now, personally, I would be unlikely to pay such prices, especially as I do not go regularly. However, I am beginning to feel a little sorry for ESPH. They haven't opened yet. The first thing anyone opening this thread will see is the prices and statement (a genuine mistake) that classes are extra, which is wrong. ESPH/Max's post is the 20th post on the thread, if people get as far as the 20th post... A member of my family has had surgery on their back and ever since has had trouble with exercising without aggravating it. The physio they had (private) was a bit hit and miss. This sort of place could be useful for a few months and, as there is no contract, they would be free to leave whenever they wanted. Good luck to ESPH.

In Lewisham, the council charge ?10 to take 3 items!! Its much better here in Southwark, but I have in the past had trouble with things like building rubble.

maxsharp Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Yoga types will be iyengar, hatha and rehab yoga > with possibly some ashtanga. You don't have to be a member to > come to the classes but as stated previously gym > membership entitles you to all the classes you > want. Hi Max If you're not a member, how much will a class cost? Good to see you coming on to the forum to let us know about these things.

Thanks Mockney! They looked pretty wow!

The fireworks are really loud and I can get a decent view if I stand on a chair... where are they? Forest Hill or Crystal Palace or is it something along the Thames like the Mayor's festival?

Yeah Louisa!! Share the love! There's an old butchers next to the Plough. Still has the tiles inside. Now its a Chinese accupunture place. Wonder when that was last a butchers - anyone know? Also, was Springers a butchers once - anyone know when that butchers last operated? Nice to know a bit about local history. Re no 6 Lordship Lane, which estate agents want to move in? Is it empty right now? There's an NHS place still operating from one of those buildings opposite the EDT. Would be interested to know if that NHS cente will remain. Sorry if this has been discussed above, but everytime I look at new posts its about all sorts of shops and I get a bit dazed and confused. :))

Thanks Marmora - you are a lovely Man! Re no 6 Lordship Lane, which property are we talking about??

Woohoo! That's great news CWALD! I'm sure he will be a very pampered pooch for the next little while. :))

What does 'hooky' organic meat mean? I think I may be on a slightly difference wavelength...

SeanMacGabhann Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- >Problem is the houses have more than 1 > family in them (oftentimes) - some of the houses > may be actually 4 flats. Tot that up along the > whole road and already it has exceeded any > possible limit > > What then? Exactly. A CPZ won't solve the problem of families having more than one car, or the fact that flats take up a lot of parking spaces. In my opinion, these are the real problems. ED has lots of houses converted into flats and too many families have two cars. If families can afford two cars - running costs, petrol, insurance etc, then they will probably be able to afford a second parking permit. Flat owners just have to pay the normal fee for their first car. If there was a CPZ, the estate agents could apply for some extra permits (not sure how many) and wouldn't be that concerned about the higher prices for 2nd/3rd/4th permits. That would just be a business cost to them. If there was a limit on numbers of permits, they could just use unmarked cars registered to the address of a friend in ED - I wouldn't put it past them!! I normally can't park outside my house, even though I easily have 2 parking spaces in front of my house. Its a pain when you have shoppping to unload etc. I used to live in an area when my house was very central and right next to all the shops/bars/restaurants. It was hard to park anywhere on my road and I would often have to park a few minutes away. I just looked upon it as the downside of living somewhere so central and I really wouldn't have swapped that location because it was so great there. Nutty - Ludlow Thompson are really pushing it though. I sympathise with your problem. :'( We used to have Wooster Stock cars parked on our road (they've now moved). Could you approach them and get an agreement from them to limit their cars to two maximum on your road? I have had experioence of a CPZ elsewhere amnd it was a nightmare. :X

SeanMacGabhann Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I too like and patronise many of the shops this > end - a bit of spit and polish wouldn't go amiss > tho Sean - I agree the shops by the Plough could do with a bit of polish! My local shops are the Underhill Rd ones next to the CPT - I got onto the council about clearing the litter there more regularly and its makes a difference.

Andyng - no not related, although I wish I did have some decent DIY people in my family! ;-) Everytime I have gone into Plough DIY, they have always been great and told me exactly what I need to do, let me sit at their desk and flick through brochures to find exactly what I want etc. Its nice you can do this - asking anyone at B&Q in Peckham is a waste of time - you are guaranteed a blank look! Plough DIY must be doing okay as they have at least 3 units on that row.

I live 5 mins walk from Plough DIY and the other shops along that parade. I would really hate to see an M&S Simply Food there. I like the fact that there are good local shops that service everyday needs. The Post Office is really useful and there are other shops there I regularly use, eg newsagents, grocery shops, florist etc. Plough DIY is always very busy and there's always a queue in there - I love that shop - they're always really helpful with advice. The shops seem to do fine because although there is passing trade from people going to Dulwich Park and the library, more important is the fact these are shops that people need and use everyday. Re new shops - I think another coffee shop would be a welcome addition to Jacks.

I went in there today to get some cake to take away and they were rushed off their feet. The girl who served me said that they were selling a lot of cake (whole cakes and slices) to take away and the demand had been much more than expected. I bought some apple tart slices and that was the last of their apple tarts (it was only 1.30pm!) She said the cakes are all baked fresh on the premises. Two cake slices came to ?5.10. I also bought two cake slices today from the Northcross Rd market stall which cost ?5.60. So not much difference in price. (Btw, I don't normally spend that much on cake - it was for a birthday treat!)

I hope the CPT stays. Its a good local. (tu)