Otta

When did I blame it on the victim complex? Quids mentioned it, and I said when I lived there (well after the 80s) I knew a fair few people who did feel that it was scoucers against the world. I then said that proved nothing, but "yeah possibly". If you're going to call me an idiot, at least be correct in what you're accusing me of.

Whatever you like.

1. I don't think SJ thought the booing was acceptable. 2. I don't think that the booing from the majority of the fans was condoning racism.

Cross posted with a few posts, and yes LFC as a club could have handled it better, although if their colleague was swearing he was innocent, and they had no reason to believe he was like that, then I guess they felt they were doing the right thing sticking up for their friend / colleague. Liverpool and victim complex... When I lived there, I met plenty of people who would tell you the whole world was against the scoucers. That is only my experience, and doesn't prove anything, but yeah, possibly. UDT, I think SJ's post was aimed at me not you. And yes, a few racist morons who support Liverpool probably have thrived on this situation, but I hope is is a very small minority. Anyway, I enjoyed the match, and am pleased with the result.

Okay firstly, I'm feeling a bit like people are suggesting that I am condoning racism here, and not "AGAINST" it as Strafer put it. If that is what anyone here thinks, then I'm not going to try and defend myself to you. What I am trying to explain to you is that a lot of people at football matches aren't overly bright, and they will follow "Their" team pretty much blindly, and will never believe their hero to be guilty. In my opinion, Suarez admitted what he said, and it was down to interpretation. The hearing decided how they interpreted it, and so he was banned. I personally don't know, and have never claimed to know what Suarez really meant that day, and the only person who really truly knows is Suarez. The fans that were booing Evra today, and singing "one Suarez" believe their man is innocent, and were booing Evra because they believe he made false accusations against their man. I am not agreeing with them, but that is why they were booing, so it was not in their hearts condoning racism. If they believed Suarez was guilty, and booed Suarez, then that WOULD BE condoning racism, but the point is they BELIEVE (perhaps misguidedly) that there man as been wronged. If anything, you rate them with too much insight. It's stupid terrace tribalism, and I'd bet money that groups of fans of any other club would have done the exact same thing in the circumstances.

Pathetic yes, but "condoning racism", I don't think so. Don't get me wrong, I am sure there were a number of brainless racist morons in amongst the crowd (as I'm sure there are at most football matches), but for the most part AM has it right. You got our player banned, so Boo to you. Pathetic yes, but not as sinister as I think some are trying to suggest.

No, it was neither.

I'm not excusing anything, I'm just saying I don't think booing Evra today was "condoning" racism.

Something on BBC website about police investigating a "racist gesture" from a supporter. Doesn't say who they support, but I guess it's more likely Liverpool (not because their fans are any more or less racist, but given some of the stick Evra got).

Yep, he could do with developing some physical stature and some command of the area.

We have one, and it is great. Different attachments for lots of jobs.

red devil Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > don't worry Liverpool fans, normal service will be resumed on Saturday ;-) Yes, yes it will. ;-) Gerrard very honest, Man U probably better team, but Liverpool did well, and took the goals when they were presented... Man U need a new keeper! Booing was harsh, but I don't think it can be labelled as condoning racism at all. A lot of the fans feel that Suarez should never have been found guilty of racist conduct (but that discussion has been done to death). I also think Evra would have gotten similar treatment at most clubs, had Suarez played elsewhere. Anyway, well pleased with that, as wasn't expecting a result. Nice to see Carroll in the thick of things too.

I dunno, I think TedMax made perfect sense of it. http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?29,772340,773192#msg-773192

Real people in costumes. I read somewhere that it cost a fortune to make.

Have you tried with different browsers? Maybe Internet Explorer instead of Firefox?

That sounds pretty perfect to me, although I couldn't care less where the food is sourced from as long as it's good quality and doesn't break the bank... Or completely take over. Another possibility would be to have the "Lounge" bar pretty much just for diners, until say 10pm when the later drinkers come in. It would be convenient for the food being brought down from upstairs, it would be a cosier eating environment (if they keep the fires), and it would leave next door for drinking / watching sport or whatever)

Yep absolutely agree with that. I'm sure the Hearne had complaints from neighbours a few years back about kids playing in the garden. Some people are morons.

You're missing my point Sue, The Actress is undoubtedly a vast improvement. The Uplands pre 2002 was a traditional pub building. It was a dive, but a nice building. It was then completely gutted, and remained a dive, but one that felt like a cinema foyer. The nice bits of the building could not be replaced. The Actress is NOT a dive (although not really my bag), and is miles better than The Uplands, buit the gutting of the building in 2002 can not be undone, so the nice stuff about it is lost forever. That is all I am trying to say, I thought it was pretty clear.

I love old woodwork and glassware in pubs, that's the sort of stuff I want to keep, whatever they do around it.

The Uplands was a dive, I just meant that the total gutting of the building in around 2002 was terrible and couldn't be reversed. The Actress is a vast improvement, but the damage was done, and it's still a loud horrible space.

Yeah, then a few years pass, and everyone wants a traditional pub again, but it's too late, because it was gutted. Look at The Uplands. I think everyone is agreed that a nice pub would be a good thing herrd, and everyone agrees that something needs to be done to bring in custom (food, better toilets ect). The disagreement seems to be that some people seem to relish the thought of the place being entirely gutted, whilst others would like to see it keep the 2 bars, which a lot of people find to be the best thing about it, 2 pubs in 1, depending on what you fancy that evening. R_D, There used to be an entrance on the corner, but what with the raised patio, I guess it would be a pain. The current entrance used to be a little off lisense cubicle. And believe it or not, it was divided in to 3 bars not 2, but that was before my time, or at least when I was very very young.

No doubt, but now he's laid the foundations, someone else can come in and reap the rewards whilst he serves hard time ;-) If he doesn't go down, he'll drop you for England anyway.

I don't think everything good at Spurs is down to Harry. With that squad and that chairman, I think plenty of managers could come in and keep them on the up.

I guess no one wanted to spend the money to convert a commercial kitchen upstairs (it's against regulations to use the residential kitchen to prepare food for customers, a friend of mine almost got shut down a few years back for trying to be nice and giving the customers some food on the bar). There is ample room upstairs for such a kitchen though.

Jah Lush Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > HMRC are quite happy to allow Vodafone to 'be > imaginative' about a figure in excess of ?2bn in > tax. Harry's amount owed is trifling in > comparison. Oh well that's alright then. Wonder what you'd be saying on here if it was Arsenal's manager in the dock... ;-)