Altima Court Residents - URGENT question

[seanmlow]

Hi -

Hope you guys can help! I used to live in Altima Court. Basically, when I moved in I called the water people to ask how I pay my bill, and they claimed it was paid by my landlord through management costs. Therefore, I assumed he had accounted for this in the rental charge.

Now he has hit me for two years water bills! I don't know if he can do this. How do owners of flats in Altima Court pay for water?

Any property lawyers PM me!

Thanks - all help welcome!

[Nick]

Hi

I work with a girl lives in Altima Court (owns flat and not tenant). Water bills are incorporated into management fees. Guess your landlord should have included this into the rent??

[seanmlow]

I would think so. I don't know how he can sting me with this after 2 years!

[Nick]

What does it state in your tenancy agreement?

[seanmlow]

Well in the agreement it does state that utilities are up to us, hence electricity and council tax were always paid on time.

When I called Thames Water when we moved in they said the whole black is billed as one, not individual flats, so they could not send me a separate bill for my dwelling. Therefore, he was paying the bill out of the management costs. I assumed, therefore, our rent was covering his management costs.

He says we should have let him know, but surely he should have contacted us if he wanted to arrange an alternative payment plan?

[jocelyn]

Sean! I knew you would be on here!

I think it is ridiculous after 2 years for this not to have been discussed. Perhaps you are best going back to the original letting agency and asking them the situation? They may have renting out more flats in this block since then and will know.

[seanmlow]

I have asked them and they said it is done through the management costs.

He has taken ?800 from my deposit.

[Keef]

Bollcks, tell him to f*k off! If he pays towards management costs that include water, then he should have bumped up the rent a bit. It's his mistake.

[Keef]

Just seen your bit about the deposit... Small claims court man! These people are little more than thieves, don't let him mug you.

[seanmlow]

I don't know what to do!

Also, the inventory he had was done by an independent company, and I NEVER SIGNED IT - how can this be legal?

If I had rented for 5 years would he have hit me with 5 years of water bills?

He is entitled to take utility bills off if not paid - but I did all i could to sort this out with Thames Water!

[lozzyloz]

Is your landlord registered? Illegal not to be. Also your deposit should be protected by the Tenancy Deposit Protection Scheme under new rules since April this year (Direct Gov). Talk to CAB. Hope you get it resolved.

[michaell]

Your tenancy agreement states that utilities are your responsibility, however you have never had your name on a water bill. How is the agreement worded? Does it mention water specifically?

The question to ask is who is responsible for the management costs? It is surely the landlord. The water is charged as a subsection of the management costs and are therefore very clearly his/her responsibility.

[Peckhamgatecrasher]

You cannot in law be billed for more than 18 months retrospectively with regard to service fees.

[Jeremy]

?800 for 2 years water? Taking the mick. Landlords always try to rip off tenents when it comes to returning their deposits, seriously it makes me furious. Don't let them get away with it.

If your landlords maintenance costs were itemised, ask for a copy of the invoice.

[seanmlow]

The water is ?460. The rest is for repairs etc despite the fact I HAVE SIGNED THE INVENTORY. Rather than repairing the matress etc, he has just replaced it all.

Peckham - where is that law about utilities?

[Mark]

can you just clarify when you moved out of Altima Court?

[lozzyloz]

I can't imagine that water rates are more than about ?250 per year for a flat

[Peckhamgatecrasher]

I know it for a fact cos I was retrospectively billed by my managing agents for various things. A solicitor in Camberwell sorted it out for me. This was about 15 years ago, but I shouldn't have thought the law has changed in this respect. Try google or maybe pay for half hour consultation - shouldn't take long for a housing solicitor to sort it out. One snotty letter should do the trick.

[seanmlow]

If anybody wants to discuss this more, can they PM me please - don't want to discuss too much on here!

[seanmlow]

Sorry I meant to say up there I HAVEN'T signed the inventory

[seanmlow]

Peckham -

how much will that cost to do that with a lawyer?

[Caron]

Seanmlo - get yourself as fast as you can to the Citizens' Advice Bureau, a wonderful service which will give you advice and check your lease. I had tons of help from them when I had a builder who charged me ?10,154 to install a bathroom which didn't work. Even if it is in your lease, how come your landlord didn't bill you before two whole years were up? I think the rest of us get bills twice a year, which helps spread the cost. Don't take this treatment. The website is

http://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/ and there is one in Peckham. It works on a first-come, first-served basis so you need to take a day off work. Good luck.

[seanmlow]

Caron -

thanks - are they open on a saturday? Just started a new job so can't really take days off yet!

[peckhamboy]

If water is part of the management charge and the management charge is his responsibility, he shouldn't be able to charge you for it other than through the rent itself (need to check exactly what the lease says). As for repairs etc, he can only charge you for damage over and above "fair wear and tear". If a mattress needed repairing/replacing, that's probably more than wear and tear (what were you doing to it??? - actually, don't answer that...)

Get an itemised list from him of the costs that make up the ?800, assess what would be fair and reasonable (eg replacing the mattress?) and offer that. If he rejects the offer or doesn't respond within a couple of weeks, suggest going through small claims if not resolved within a further reasonable period eg 1 month. But be prepared to go through with it and keep copies of all correspondence/notes of telephone calls. county court likely to be more amenable if you have acted reasonably throughout and if you made a fair offer.

[Administrator]

Moving this to the Lounge as it's no longer East Dulwich specific. Good luck in getting it sorted.