Man stabbed killed lordship lane / East Dulwich grove

[Robert Poste's Child]

And to the poor people who work in the shop and apparently tried to stop an argument. A horrible thing for them to have to deal with.

[ianjm]

Let me start by saying, of course this is a terrible tragedy, but I agree with those saying this doesn't mean Dulwich isn't relatively safe with somewhat lower crime than the surrounding areas.

Have a look at: http://a.plumplot.co.uk/?tab=crime_map_s&yr=-13&pc=11&ct=15

SE22-8 has a crime level at 116% of the National Average, and SE22-9 is 97% of the National Average. This is the average for the whole country so compared to the rest of Greater London and the surrounding areas it's comfortably low.

Violent crime is 84% and 67% of the national average, respectively.

The main issue that stands out is robbery (I assume muggings) which is 6-7x higher than the national average.

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

A complete tragedy and a life taken needlessly. Very close to home that these senseless deaths can occur anytime and anywhere.

I?ve always felt safe here as I was born here so that familiarity can lure me into a false sense of safety especially when outside family members point out the crime rate here is very high compared to their areas but it?s hardly surprising with the shops and drinking establishments that Dulwich isn?t going to be crime free.

ianjm Wrote:

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> Let me start by saying, of course this is a

> terrible tragedy, but I agree with those saying

> this doesn't mean Dulwich isn't relatively safe

> with somewhat lower crime than the surrounding

> areas.

>

> Have a look at:

> http://a.plumplot.co.uk/?tab=crime_map_s&yr=-13&pc

> =11&ct=15

>

> SE22-8 has a crime level at 116% of the National

> Average, and SE22-9 is 97% of the National

> Average. This is the average for the whole country

> so compared to the rest of Greater London and the

> surrounding areas it's comfortably low.

>

> Violent crime is 84% and 67% of the national

> average, respectively.

>

> The main issue that stands out is robbery (I

> assume muggings) which is 6-7x higher than the

> national average.

[snoopy17]

can't believe people are acting like Camberwell and Peckham are no where near ed, from dog kennel hill both are a quick ten minute walk.

[Bic Basher]

First of all, thoughts with the family of the man who lost his life. Secondly, I've lived here since 1983 and have always felt safe here compared to other parts of London. To be fair, I now feel as safe going to Peckham or Brixton than I did in the 80s and 90s.

[Alan Medic]

HelBel65 Wrote:

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> Terrible news.

>

> I was a bit taken aback to hear Andrew Castle on

> LBC this morning referring to ED as ?a rough area?

> where you ?really have to watch yourself? Maybe

> he?s right after this.

I listen to Andrew Castle fairly often and he is particularly uninformed for a broadcaster.

[Reg Smeeton]

Some perspective - in 1985 an off-duty policeman, George Hammond, was stabbed at a very similar location on Lordship Lane. And I think that was late evening rather than the small hours. I'd say East Dulwich felt less safe then than it does now (in those days the East Dulwich Tavern was a hang-out for crooks, for example).

[lidsey]

Alan Medic Wrote:

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> HelBel65 Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Terrible news.

> >

> > I was a bit taken aback to hear Andrew Castle

> on

> > LBC this morning referring to ED as ?a rough

> area?

> > where you ?really have to watch yourself? Maybe

> > he?s right after this.

>

> I listen to Andrew Castle fairly often and he is

> particularly uninformed for a broadcaster.

How dare you discuss on this post about whats the best part of East Dulwich to live in No consideration for the poor family and friends of this local man .

[Dulwich Born And Bred]

We also had that poor boy that was stabbed after visiting a party at Dulwich Hamlet. There was also a non fatal stabbing last year. Plus one by the train station and one in a hostel both fatal.

[lidsey]

HOW DARE YOU ALL DISCUSS ON THIS POST ABOUT WHATS THE BEST PART OF EAST DULWICH TO LIVE IN NO CONSIDERATION FOR THE POOR FAMILY AND FRIENDS .

[CatrionaHelen]

I live in the area that was cordoned off for most of the morning. I took some cups of tea out to the police who were redirecting people and managing the road closure etc. They said they were surprised to be attending this kind of incident in LL. But a person died. Parents no longer have a son, people have lost a friend. What does it matter what postcode it happened in?

[savvygirl]

I am slightly confused as Robert Poste's Child wrote "And to the poor people who work in the shop and apparently tried to stop an argument. A horrible thing for them to have to deal with."

Not sure whether this means the victim and assailant were arguing in the 24 hour shop prior to the attack. That would make the staff key witnesses. I hope they catch the assailant soon. It's a terrible tragedy and my heart goes out to the victim's family.

[JohnL]

DulwichFox Wrote:

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> Not many if not any places open around here at

> 02.30am

>

> Not many people either I would of thought ??

Bishop closes at 2:00 on a Saturday - I often used to stay until then (only going out at 11:00 PM mind) as I liked a late night pint.

[creditwheredue]

savvygirl Wrote:

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> I am slightly confused as Robert Poste's Child

> wrote "And to the poor people who work in the shop

> and apparently tried to stop an argument. A

> horrible thing for them to have to deal with."

>

> Not sure whether this means the victim and

> assailant were arguing in the 24 hour shop prior

> to the attack. That would make the staff key

> witnesses. I hope they catch the assailant soon.

> It's a terrible tragedy and my heart goes out to

> the victim's family.

ITV News said the victim and assailant were arguing in the shop.

[Robert Poste's Child]

That was according to some of the press coverage earlier in the day. I don't know what happened any more than anyone else on here, but it was clear they witnessed some of it so it must have been really terrifying for them.

[roywj]

Reg Smeeton Wrote:

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> Some perspective - in 1985 an off-duty policeman,

> George Hammond, was stabbed at a very similar

> location on Lordship Lane. And I think that was

> late evening rather than the small hours. I'd say

> East Dulwich felt less safe then than it does now

> (in those days the East Dulwich Tavern was a

> hang-out for crooks, for example).

[NewWave]

Jules-and-Boo Wrote:

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> East Dulwich is hardly crime free or particularly

> safe. It's absolutely tragic that a young man lost

> his life but please....don't divert the attention

> this post needs.

>

> It's really NOT about the debating the public

> perception of the area.

totally agree.

[ianjm]

NewWave Wrote:

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> totally agree.

This forum is full of middle class Dulwich residents. That's who's writing posts and who's read the posts. Of course people are going to talk about how it affects the area, that's what this is for. If people want to set out some sort of social justice platform I don't think this is the place.

[hellosailor]

It?s got nothing to do with the area it happened in, this was a poor poor bloke who declined to give a random person a cigarette and had his throat cut. I?d guess the person was extremely mentally unwell. I think it?s pretty crass to start debating what is does or doesn?t say about the area. It?s a horrific thing to happen.

[ianjm]

hellosailor Wrote:

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> It?s got nothing to do with the area it happened

> in, this was a poor poor bloke who declined to

> give a random person a cigarette and had his

> throat cut. I?d guess the person was extremely

> mentally unwell. I think it?s pretty crass to

> start debating what is does or doesn?t say about

> the area. It?s a horrific thing to happen.

The only reason we're talking about it is because it was in this area. There was a shooting and two other stabbings in London this morning. There were 150 murders in Brazil today. I don't see a thread about any of them.

I'm sorry for the man who's been killed and his family, really I am, but to suggest we have to respect some sort of online mourning period and not talk about this in context strikes me as a bit unnecessary. I guess if that makes me crass, I'm crass.

?\_(ツ)_/?

[Robert Poste's Child]

They were responding initially to a silly claim by a GLR presenter after this horrible incident, so a slightly different thing.

I'd add that it's not the right place to speculate about the person's mental health - I'd say that anyway, but see earlier comments about any future legal case. I'm sure we wouldn't want to make this any harder for the family and friends of the man who lost his life.

[rendelharris]

ianjm Wrote:

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> The only reason we're talking about it is because

> it was in this area. There was a shooting and two

> other stabbings in London this morning. There were

> 150 murders in Brazil today. I don't see a thread

> about any of them.

Well yes, and I don't suppose people in Brazil are talking about a murder in East Dulwich. That doesn't imply a lack of concern about others on either side, people will naturally be concerned about such happenings in their area and discuss them, particularly on a forum specifically dedicated to discussing local issues.

Entirely agree with RPC that speculations as to causes and motives are not helpful when none of us knows the story, the police have the suspect in custody, let justice take its course.

ETA correction, I mistakenly thought the suspect was in custody, apparently not. Hope this changes soon.

[se22cat]

First of all, I'd just like to say how sorry I am that this has happened; we live a minute away from the location and my thoughts go out to the man's family.

Regarding how the area has changed; despite the increase in muggings, personally, I feel the area seems a lot safer in the past year compared to the previous five. The number of habitual substance abusers hanging around the Goose Green area, many of which would aggressively harass people for money has significantly dropped, which I assume must be down to one or more of the crack houses being shut down by the police. Of course, the loss of our local Police station and the rarity of actual beat cops has had a major impact in the rise of crime, violent or otherwise in the area.

Perhaps due to ED losing it's "cool" status amongst the 18-25 year olds largely from outside the area not filling the pubs around Goose Green and the streets are less coated with vomit and there's definitely less of the odd nasty fight on the way home waking me up. With the drop in younger people with disposable incomes and hungry nostrils, the previous abundance of street dealers have all but abandoned the area and seem to just drop in to do business by car these days.

As a frequent late night customer of the store in question, encounters with aggressive beggars, more often than not seemingly with brains fried on long term skunk and alcohol abuse are unfortunately and annoyingly a very regular occurrence, it's no wonder the people working there look stressed during the night shifts.

[Delainie]

I can't imagine how his friends and family are feeling,terrible news.I hope the police catch the scum and throw away the key whether in a prison or mental institution I don't care just take his freedom away for a very very long time.its just so depressing hearing of stabbings so often,I don't know what is wrong with some people.

[Bic Basher]

ITV News this evening.