"New" bus routes starting 15th June

[dbboy]

From Saturday 15 June, there will be changes to bus route 12, which runs between Oxford Circus Station, Margaret Street and Dulwich Library.

Following reductions in demand we are changing the frequency, and buses will now run as follows:

every 7-8 minutes on Monday ? Saturday daytimes

every 10 minutes early mornings and evenings everyday

every 8-9 minutes on Sundays

For help planning your journey, visit our website.

Yours sincerely,

Claire Mann

Director of Bus Operations

[Sue]

I travelled into town today during the rush hour (set off around 8.20)

I was expecting a horrendous journey.

It wasn't! I know the stop outside the Post Office tends to get crowded, so I went to the one before.

Got on the bus easily enough but yes it was crowded and I had to stand. For one stop! People got off at North Cross Road and I got a seat upstairs.

After that, many people got off at the two stations and then the hospital. Nobody who was going further than that who was already on the bus would have had to stand.

I was expecting loads of traffic and queues, but it was an easy run apart from a slight delay to "even out the service" and a bit of a delay around the Strand and Trafalgar Square.

I had left loads of time so had to go and sit in a little park for nearly half an hour before my appointment!

[twister]

I get the 40 to and from work. I normally leave the house around 5am. I have been known to get the first 40 of the day, which if anyone is interested is 3:15am. People get on at most of the stops. It?s mostly cleaners, coffee shop workers etc. I?m going to switch to cycling. How safe that will be at 5am I will find out next week......

[natty01295]

Be Safe, Be Seen when Cycling

Hope you have a Safe journey!!!

* Lights

* High vis

* Gloves

[Bic Basher]

So in the last 18 months or so we've had the following changes from TfL.

185 increased to every 8 minutes.

P13 increased to every 15 mins.

42 extended from Denmark Hill to East Dulwich Sainsburys via North Dulwich.

And then this....

176 reduced from every 8 minutes to 10.

40 rerouted to Clerkenwell Green missing London Bridge, Monument and Aldgate.

12 reduced to every 7/8 mins

It seems for every bus change that is an advantage, they take away with the other.

[Nigello]

Bus travel is cheap and effective but people make it hard for themselves and others by not moving upstairs or by congregating around the doors. If you're one of them, just consider moving down or up. The journey will be quicker because the driver won't have to keep stopping to ask people to move down or upstairs. I agree, though, that the fare freeze has had consequences and some people will be inconvenienced.

[Rosetta]

What will be alternative ways to get to London Bridge from the 15 June by bus from ED?

[TheArtfulDogger]

Rosetta Wrote:

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> What will be alternative ways to get to London

> Bridge from the 15 June by bus from ED?

But not without changing !

[Bic Basher]

Rosetta Wrote:

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> What will be alternative ways to get to London

> Bridge from the 15 June by bus from ED?

35 from Camberwell Green or change at Elephant for the 35 or 133. The 343 also stops nearby.

[Humdinger]

There will be plenty of easy ways to get to London Bridge by bus once the 40 changes.

I'm pretty sure TFL thought it all through. They are unlikely to have put on blindfolds and pointed at a random bus route and thought, right lets make changes to that one. They will have carefully considered the changes to each route by taking into account that passengers can rather easily hop off one bus and onto another at no extra cost and very little inconvenience. The centre of London is unnecessarily clogged up with empty buses. This needs to change.

[JohnL]

Humdinger Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> There will be plenty of easy ways to get to London

> Bridge by bus once the 40 changes.

>

> I'm pretty sure TFL thought it all through. They

> are unlikely to have put on blindfolds and pointed

> at a random bus route and thought, right lets make

> changes to that one. They will have carefully

> considered the changes to each route by taking

> into account that passengers can rather easily hop

> off one bus and onto another at no extra cost and

> very little inconvenience. The centre of London is

> unnecessarily clogged up with empty buses. This

> needs to change.

They should monitor it a bit like a data/phone network - I notice Thameslink like the word core these days.

But if there's an external (political) mission that might make things different.

[Zebedee Tring]

Humdinger, it's not easy for everyone to hop easily from one bus to another. A year ago I was about to have a hip replacement and found it difficult to get on and off a bus. I am in much better shape now but there are masses of people who would struggle to do what you suggest.

[Bic Basher]

Zebedee Tring Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Humdinger, it's not easy for everyone to hop

> easily from one bus to another. A year ago I was

> about to have a hip replacement and found it

> difficult to get on and off a bus. I am in much

> better shape now but there are masses of people

> who would struggle to do what you suggest.

Indeed, it'll be those who find it hard to change buses due to health issues who'll be forced onto cabs to Guys due to TfL's misjudged decision to reroute the only direct bus route from ED to London Bridge.

[rupert james]

As the old British habit of queuing is long dead, it will be the fittest and inconsiderate that will be able to change buses with out any problems.

I doubt if TFL ever thought of this.

[jamesmcash]

Just to let you know that the councillors are discussing this. We opposed the changes in the consultation process but as you know the changes to the 12 bus were not mentioned.

Best wishes

James

[NewWave]

jamesmcash Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Just to let you know that the councillors are

> discussing this. We opposed the changes in the

> consultation process but as you know the changes

> to the 12 bus were not mentioned.

>

> Best wishes

> James

Thank you. This is actually going to have a very negative impact on many local people.

[mary123]

There are so many bus stops on lordship lane, particularly the middle part, the bus moved away from the bus stop and the next one is very close by, this slows down the time to travel to through Dulwich and another increase to journey times.

[Bic Basher]

Looks like some of those spare 12s are now on the 176 today as every single bus I've been on is those infernal greenhouses.

[peckham_ryu]

How does TfL assess ?demand?? If they use fare data, it?s not a surprise that the 12 is statistically under-capacity. At my stop, about 75% of adults board without tapping. It?s been yonks since I?ve seen ticket inspectors.

dbboy Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

  Quote

From Saturday 15 June, there will be changes to bus route 12, which runs between Oxford Circus

Station, Margaret Street and Dulwich Library.

Following reductions in demand we are changing the frequency, and buses will now run as follows: every 7-8 minutes on Monday ? Saturday daytimes every 10 minutes early mornings and evenings everyday every 8-9 minutes on Sundays For help planning your journey, visit our website.

Yours sincerely,

Claire Mann

Director of Bus Operations

[Nigello]

The 12 is going to get 130-capacity extra-long double deckers. (See other post.)

[Johnjohn]

Response from TFL

"Thanks for you detailed email of 13 June about the changes bus route 12.

I?m sorry for all the inconvenience caused by the overcrowding during peak time rush hour. I understand why you would be frustrated by reducing the frequency of buses operating on this route.

However, changes are made according to demand. I appreciate you bringing this concerns to my attention; we value feedback from our customers to how we can improve and develop our network.

We make every effort to ensure our bus services meet the demands of our customers. Usage is regularly reviewed to ensure that our bus routes provide sufficient capacity. We also closely monitor the reliability of our routes to ensure that customers receive a regular, dependable service.

I have passed your email to our Network Development team who are responsible for monitoring bus network usage and implementing changes that benefit our customers.

If so they?ll look to see if it?s viable to increase the frequency of the bus.

If it isn?t possible to increase the frequency of the service, but there is a shortfall in capacity, they may be able increase the capacity of the bus by other means and will look into this possibility."

This is 33% reduction in frequency!!

Perhaps I could understand a reduction in the service outside of rush hour, but during rush hour the service is very, very busy.

The new lower frequency will mean a possible 15+ minute wait of there are any delays in the service (ie. A bus is taken out, or there are heavy roadworks along the route causing heavy congestion.)

Like a previous post, I am concerned that the changes made are measured on information which is not reliable.

How can they measure how many people use the service when many passengers do not even touch in.

There are many passengers who have bus passes or travel cards which do not require touching in or out, so how could you possibly know how many people are using the service.

The suggestion of increasing the capacity of the bus itself is a totally inadequate remedy to a reduction in frequency.

This is a very disappointing decision given that as a City and a borough we are supposed to encouraging people out of their cars.

[sally buying]

The number 12 from Oxford Circus to Peckham route has always been known as the charity bus because nobody checks in and the bus is never checked

[BernieG]

I had no idea about the changes until I read this thread though I've certainly noticed the negative effects this past week - slower journeys and overcrowding during rush hour. Many people rely on the frequency of the number 12 to get to to Peckham Rye to use the overground trains. I'm sure some people may say leave earlier to allow for the delays, though I know there are many parents who can't when you have to drop off to school or nursery in the mornings. Fine if you're lucky and have an understanding boss and flexible working though for those who don't it can be very stressful. Same goes for the journey home when many people will be rushing to make pick up on time.

[intexasatthe moment]

Central London is clogged with buses ,some rationalisation is necessary .

The existing infrastructure of narrow roads can't support the volume of public transport needed to meet demand .

[Ruffler]

I also see many people boarding number 12s without tapping in their cards. If presumably demand is measured by paying customers, these people are hitting services for the rest of us.