Rye Lane Cycle Path

[royalsam1981]

As someone fairly new to this biking lark, can anyone tell me why the cycle path at the end of Rye Lane can't be painted blue?

Now I know that pedestrians walking out in front of cyclists isn't a new thing but it seems particularly bad down Rye Lane and to be fair, it's not that obvious that the thin bit of pavement is a bike path.

It's only a matter of time that someone gets hurt!

[PeckhamRose]

They already have. Write to the council with your concerns?

[Renata Hamvas]

Hi royalsam1981

I will raise it with council officers,

Renata

[PatriciaS]

I'm pretty new to it too but I think only the main roads on the cycle highways for !boris bikes! are painted blue. Good to get writing to the council with your concerns or just be mindful of sleepy pedestrians in the morning and cycle a little slower.

[intexasatthe moment]

My understanding ( from expressing dislike when this was just a proposal )is that the cycle lane between Smiths and Boots in Rye Lane is based on the concept of " shared space " .

A reason for the apparent paradox that reduced regulation leads to safer roads may be found by studying the risk compensation effect.[7]

"Shared space is successful because the perception of risk may be a means or even a prerequisite for increasing objective safety. Because when a situation feels unsafe, people are more alert and there are fewer accidents."[citation needed]

"We're losing our capacity for socially responsible behaviour, ...The greater the number of prescriptions, the more people's sense of personal responsibility dwindles."(Der Spiegel quotes Monderman)[8]

"When you don't exactly know who has right of way, you tend to seek eye contact with other road users... You automatically reduce your speed, you have contact with other people and you take greater care."[9]

"To understand how shared space works, it is important to move away from reliance on 'rights' and laws, and to recognize the potential for conventions and protocols ... Such conventions and protocols evolve rapidly and are very effective if the state does not intervene through regulation." (Shared Space Expert Team)[10]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shared_space

I don't think it works in this setting and when cycling I simply avoid it - although perhaps that's an example of how the concept "works" .

[nunhead_man]

The blue paint on some roads is for the Cycle Super Highways - see here - http://www.tfl.gov.uk/roadusers/cycling/11901.aspx

Boris chose blue for at least two obvious reasons. And those routes are generally badly implemented e.g. the cyclist deaths at Bow Roundabout. Most are just paint on the road some of which lead cyclists into danger.

The more usual colour for cycle routes is green

And on Peckham's Rye Lane we have two of the 50 shades of grey plus a few roundels with a cycle image posing as a cycle path.

The real problem at the southern end of the Canal towpath route are the steps on the left as you head north - the ones that come down from Peckham Pulse - the ramp gives you speed and pedestrians coming down the steps are out of sight - you have to go down the ramp very carefully especially out of communiting hours in case someone is coming down the steps - small children are out of sight until they step out.

Changing those steps to be open to the sight line for north moving cyclists would be a start.

[ondined]

I've always thought it's deliberately designed to be ambiguous to slow cyclists down. I can't see how painting it a different colour will stop pedestrians wandering into it and pedestrians/cyclists getting hurt, only that cyclists would probably going faster and collisions would be worse.

[The Minkey]

It was an extremely poorly conceived idea given that given it's alongside a single lane bus route and people cross between the backed up buses from where they can't see oncoming cyclists. Worse, if you are unfamiliar with that section of town, get off a bus and go to cross the road, how are you expected to know you aren't simply crossing onto the pavement, the cycle path is simply not evident enough.

[Horsebox]

Another problem is that it's not obvious to many cyclists that the path is actually one-way (from the library up Rye Lane).

And another, is the odd positioning of the push-button at the traffic light junction, again not obvious to many.

And another, the way a lot of cyclists see it fit to come off the crossing by the library and cut straight across the pavement rather than follow the clearly labelled start of the path.

Yet another problem is the speed that some cyclists feel is necessary when using it, though this has more to do with aggressive, inconsiderate twats on bikes than the implementation of the path itself.

Perhaps, Renata, you could also raise the first 2 issues here.

As for the 3rd, maybe an increase in PCSO's at the crossing to politely warn offenders not to cycle on the section of pavement would have an effect?

[Horsebox]

T-wats is s censored word? lol.

[pipsky2008]

ondined Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I've always thought it's deliberately designed to

> be ambiguous to slow cyclists down. I can't see

> how painting it a different colour will stop

> pedestrians wandering into it and

> pedestrians/cyclists getting hurt, only that

> cyclists would probably going faster and

> collisions would be worse.

I agree. I think the whole thing is silly. I cycle this space daily and nine times out of ten, depending on the time of day, I'll just get off and walk as it's more trouble than it's worth to upset the natural inclination of persons to walk across the road to the shops, or for whatever reason, than to continue cycling the 100 Meters or so to the junction with HSBC/Primark. A very poor piece of thinking in my opinion altogether. Cyclists are at an advantage of speed over pedestrians and can well afford a short diversion around the back of the Morissons complex to allow that space to be used by pedestrians and buses collecting and dropping off passengers only.

[Peckhampoet]

totally daft idea and I nearly got hit by a cyclist t'other day as had no idea there was a cycle path there!! Totally illogical to have it going opposite direction to the buses in a street that has no other traffic and is surely mainly for pedestrians Back to the drawing board!

[katanita]

I had a spectacular wipeout on this a couple of years ago when I rode up onto it to overtake a stationary bus heading towards the library and caught the back wheel on the edge as it's raised a couple of inches. So yeah, not a fan. And the fact that it's a contraflow is really unclear as mentioned. Couldn't they just widen the road a little more and mark out a cycle lane on it?

[binary_star]

Couple of threads on it already, seems people have aired the same opinions about it being unsafe:

http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?20,950987,951914

http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?20,544168,545298

Personally I avoid it and go round the back of Bellenden/Burger King to get to Surrey Canal which is really very out of my way but at least I'm not narrowly avoiding hitting pedestrians all the time!

[henryb]

I don't mind the shared bike lane. You can avoid collisions if you slow down and use your bell or whistle loudly.

[miss_mystra]

I only use it on my way to work in the mornings, it really needs to be signed better.

I can't work out whether it's one way (ie from the libary crossing to Primark only) or both as coming from the opposite way (which is what i'm doing in the morning) there are signs on lamposts facing me - in my eyes is that to tell me there is a cycle path there or is it just to warn pedestrians? It shouldn't be confusing - confusing leads to accidents. I just stay on the bus lane - it's easier although people still like to look me in the eye and walk out in front of me on the road too - and why do so many try to push buggies into the road (ie when the parent is still on the pavement waiting to cross) - i've nearly been hit twice, i've grown accustomed to giving them a wide berth instead now - bit of commmon sense to not stick a buggy out into a busy road surely - not bothered about me, i tend to be pretty bullet proof but babies and toddlers are not (my own mum learned this lesson the hard way when i was a baby myself - although i do have her epically thick knitted bobble hat to thank for coming out of that accident alive - the driver drove off without a trace!)

I do like the Surrey Canal route though, nice to cycle at a leisurely pace through the greenery :)

[henryb]

That seems to be a very common impression of shared spaces - that people think they are dangerous and confusing; no one knows who has right of way there are lots of near misses and minor knocks and people get in each others way. That is actually by design and you have to use your own judgement about who to give way to how fast to go rather than relying signs and road markings.

The interesting thing is they actually make roads safer for everyone and serious accidents especially are very much reduced.

[titch juicy]

I use it twice a day everyday and have never had any problems. As long as you're prepared to slow right down and be patient with pedestrians it's no bother.

Ill-conceived schemes are only ill-conceived if the people using them don't use them sensibly or properly.

[henryb]

According to crash map there have been no reported collisions between cyclists and pedestrians resulting in injury since it was opened.

[Medley]

It's a mixed use path so it's not about pedestrians wandering, it's about both sides needing to watch out for the other.

Not ideal, but that's how it is.

Painting it Tory/Barclays blue won't make any difference at all. And as another poster has said, the Cycle Superhighways (nothing in themselves to do with so-called Boris bikes) have their own problems, some of them very serious.

[DJKillaQueen]

Simon Philips who designed the scheme at southwark doesn't care anyway......he thinks his design is right.

More worrying is the tarmac that is sinking under the weight of buses at the junction with the high street. Is it really so difficult for southwark to find people that can build roads properly?

[intexasatthe moment]

And the people who carried out the " consultation " on the improvements of which this cycle way formed part didn't care either .

Having learnt of the proposal in the local press I went to the Peckham Pulse library expecting details or advice - no they'd no knowledge of it .

Eventually I got a phone number of the consultants carrying out the "consultation " - they had no idea of where the nearest library was to the proposed works but assured me that they had leafleted all local shops and residential properties .

None of the shops I approached admitted to receiving anything and my mother who lives very close to this spot had received nothing .

Wonder how much Southwark paid for that bit of window dressing ?

[Medley]

What consultation?!

[DaveR]

I use the cycle path every day without too many problems. It would be better if it were more clearly marked as shared space because at the moment, as many have commented, plenty of pedestrians just don't realise that it is also used by bikes. And obviously cyclists need to ride differently compared to how they would either on the road or a bikes only route; this also applies to the Surrey Canal path where IMO too many people ride far too fast.

[miss_mystra]

DaveR Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I use the cycle path every day without too many

> problems. It would be better if it were more

> clearly marked as shared space because at the

> moment, as many have commented, plenty of

> pedestrians just don't realise that it is also

> used by bikes. And obviously cyclists need to

> ride differently compared to how they would either

> on the road or a bikes only route; this also

> applies to the Surrey Canal path where IMO too

> many people ride far too fast.

Agree about people going too fast along Surrey Canal - i like to take my time along there. If i'm in a rush i'll use the roads... but i can rarely be bothered to rush! It's nice to enjoy a bit of green space/no traffic to worry about and all cyclists should respect the other park users and not race down there. It's really annoying when i carefully look behind me before i overtake a pedestrian for some loony to overtake me at breakneck speed... what's the rush, it's not the Tour de France!