Be careful in Grove Vale

[pk]

MadWorld74 Wrote:

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> I was into thinking that asylums were dispanded in

> the early 90's due to a new law passed on the

> treatment of the 'mentally ill' in 1980.

>

> Who do the Maudsley actually cater for, tell me

> more Snorky?

http://www.slam.nhs.uk/services/sitelist.aspx?site=Maudsley+Hospital

[MadWorld74]

hhmmm yes I've already had a look at that.

PK quote: with the Maudsley just up the road ED and Camberwell probably see more than their fair share of 'mad' people, but 'mad' does not necessarily 'bad' (though it might mean socially inappropriate anyway)'

The Maudsley; their patients aren't a 'danger' are they? .....sorry to sound Victorian!

[ontheedge]

Q. Who does the Maudsley cater for

A. The local community so that could be anyone of us.

pk what do you suggest a fair share of mad people is. Maybe the Maudsley and it's famous history have attracted many of the more recent housebuyers to the area as it is only since the early ninties that you had to be from the actual area to receive treatment there prior to that it treated London wide.

[Bellenden Belle]

> The Maudsley; their patients aren't a 'danger' are

> they? .....sorry to sound Victorian!

No Madworld - people with mental health issues are not normally a "danger". In fact statistics show people with mental ill health are far more likely to be the victims of crime than the perpetuators. And those at the Maudsley are the ones actually being treated - it's the ones who sit at home, frightened of the tag of being "mad", becoming more and more socially isolated that are cause for concern.

The mental health charity I work with sometimes does gigs south of the river - I'll post when the next one is on - and please don't take this post as anything other than an answer to your question -I'm glad you asked, as I bet loads of people wonder the same.

[AllforNun]

Crack will make you mad no doubt about it. It's a bad world out there folks.

[pk]

ontheedge Wrote:

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> Q. Who does the Maudsley cater for

> A. The local community so that could be anyone of

> us.

>

> pk what do you suggest a fair share of mad people

> is. Maybe the Maudsley and it's famous history

> have attracted many of the more recent housebuyers

> to the area as it is only since the early ninties

> that you had to be from the actual area to receive

> treatment there prior to that it treated London

> wide.

by fair share i mean more than a random area - as inevitably the hospital brings people to the immediate vicinity

it's not a problem for me

[snorky]

The Maudsley deal with a wide range inclding eating disorders and suchlike.

LOndon is full of people who may not conform to what is considered the norm, but very few anything but an annoyance

The most dangerous have probabaly never hadd a days treatment in their lives

[MadWorld74]

thanks guys...I asked because when I lived in Brighton I was attacked by a man who was from the local 'hospital' and receiving care. He was a patient under the new Care in the Community and as a result, no prosecution could be made against him. I think that has clouded my views somewhat since then.

I am however going to be taking part in a run for the chairty MIND in May of this year, running to raise money for those who suffer from mental illness. I think living in London, some of us at some point are likely to suffer from some sort of 'mental illness' ie: depression, due to stress; and depression no matter how slight, is a mental illness.

[ontheedge]

There is no reason why someone with mental health problems who has commited a crime cannot be prosecuted and charged. The difference in senteance would be if the crime is driven by mental illness. Violence is not a sign or symptom of mental illness. Crimes are much more likely to be committed by people who have taken drugs or alcohol, but lets not get into the debate as to whether this is an illness or lifestyle choice

[MadWorld74]

well...that's what the rozzers told me after it had happend. And I guess I didn't know better myself.

[charlie29]

This guy is still hanging around the bus stop across from the station and still hassling people for money - men and women. I've seen him many a time before (he used to hand around Queens Rd Peckham station but has clearly moved on to a "nicer" area) In the course of my work I have dealt with many drug addicts and believe me this guy is a crack addict. The sad fact is that crack addicts can be very agressive and dangerous. Be very careful when he approaches you - he usually leaves after a firm no but I have seen him go through a man's pockets when he refused to give him money. My suggestion is if you are at the bus stop and see this man approach anyone then keep an eye out for each other, don't just stand and watch him hassle other pople, check that they're OK and he'll proibably leave without too much fuss...

[SeanMacGabhann]

does he drift up to the bottom of LL these days - I've noticed someone who fits teh description outside EDT several times over the last week or two

He's pretty unavoidable and so possibly intimidating but seems to accept no quite quickly

[scotslass]

I thought that he had moved on somewhere else, but then he re-appeared at the end of last week. Can almost guarantee that when I get off my bus he appears between the bus stop and Grove Vale library

[Brendan]

There are 2 guys that I have noticed. One who hangs around Denmark Hill station and the one who hangs around grove vale.

A few weeks ago the guy in grove vale was at the payphone and with a fiver in his hand asked me if I had change for it so he could use the phone. Thinking he was genuine I took 50p out of my pocket and said don?t worry about it mate have this.

Then on Monday night I he approached me again when I was walking home. This time a recognised him and quite firmly said no and walked on past. Then afterwards, as I always do in these situations, I felt like I should have been more understanding.

[PeckhamRose]

This, and all the other reports and topics regarding being hassled / bullied / mugged and/or worse on this forum should also be sent to the Safer Neighbourhood Team.

Can we have their details at the stickied top of each forum page please Administrator?

For now, go into the Southwark Council website and follow the links.

Elsewhere on this site some folk have posted the phone numbers.

(Sorry, working, not time to search for it now myself.)

I go to the Nunhead and peckham Rye Ward Panel meetings and there's one in a week or two, but do go to the Dulwich one mentioned above. It's a great resource and you can look at the Community Wardens some of you despise so much in the eye and hear them talk about what they do, too!

scotslass Wrote:

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> Don't know what SNT is? Not been using the forum

> long:-$

[Brendan]

He asked me for money again tonight. This time up near Budgens. I decided to point out that he has asked me for cash on 2 previous occasions and that I had no intention of giving him any. This just encouraged him. I think because I had started talking to him. In the end I had to be pretty firm which seemed to upset him but he buggered off at least.

[Steph]

I was at the little park at Sainsbury?s a few weeks ago with my young baby and there was one other mum with her little one. He approached both of us hassling us for money, he was very intimidating. You could see he was totally wired and he wasn?t taking no for an answer. It was only when a few passing people stopped and started watching him that he decided to go. I don?t usually panic too much but when you?ve got your kids with you and someone is high on crack its pretty scary. I would just walk pretty fast if I seen him again but would also make a point of watching him if he was driving someone else mad. He?s a fricking pest.

[KidKruger]

I got hassled for money by a bloke yesterday evening (Tuesday) around 1830 at the same bus stop by the DIY shop opposite ED station.

Not sure if it was the same guy - this guy was around the 6ft mark, slim or athletic rather than fat and had a very confident look in his eye. I provided a confident look by return and said no mate, he went off, but I waited for the bus the remaining time facing the pavement where he walked off towards the Vale bar.

I would not have let him walk behind me put it that way he seemed definitely up for it.

It's a shame so many folks are feeling uncomfortable just trying to get to or from home.

[Ingenuity]

It's a few weeks back now but i had what sounds like the same guy pester me for money.

He was outside the Domino's pizza place on Grove Vale.

He was very persistence and had a bit of an edge to him. When i said i didnt have any cash he suggested i go to a cash machine and get some for him. Not one to be reasoned with and i was quite worried as i live not far down the road by the station and didnt really want him watching and seeing where i lived.

I've not seen him since but he's certainly not the sort of person i want hanging around.

And i'm a tad under six foot and a bloke so i don't think he discriminates!

[Dave337]

FYI the contact details for the East Dulwich SNT are:

07920 233912

[email protected]

I think this thread is a perfect example of the type of activity the SNTs are here to deal with. If you can pass as much info on to them to allow them to build up a picture of the individual and his movements then they can look to focus resources on dealing with the issue.

I'll also send a PM to the Sgt, Duncan Jackson. At the last Ward Panel meeting we were asking for priorities for the SNT to pursue and I think this fits the bill admirably. Hopefully they may well be able to alter foot patrol routes and timings to increase their presence in Grove Vale at likely times of trouble (once they know). It will be nice case study to see what the SNT can achieve.

Dave

[rlane]

This guy is very intimidating. He approached me last night 8.00pm, when I had my wallet in my hand paying for my rail ticket at the ticket machine near Domino's. He said he needed money to buy food so, as I had my cash out I gave him a couple of quid. He then said he wanted notes, so I of course said no. It took ages to get rid of him. I didn't fancy waiting on the empty platform by myself, so I waited down on the street and he approached me for a second time asking for more money. Luckily by the time I'd got rid of him the train was due so I was able to get on that.

I don't care if he is on crack or has mental problems - when you can't shake him off it is thoroughly unpleasant! I am a six foot man in my 40's and I found it very unsettling, so this must really upset elderly people or women with kids that he pesters.

I have just phoned the SNT (thanks for the number Dave!) and they said that they have had a few reports of this bloke and will increase patrols in the Grove Vale area.

[Keef]

I saw him (not for the first time) on Lordship Lane last week, at the bus stop outside Favourite Fried Chicken.

I think the intimidating thing about him is the way he gets so close to you, I hate people in my personal space, and he is right in your face. I did just say No to him though, and he walked straight to the next person. I am surprised, and slightly concerned about some of the other posts on here about his actions.

I do feel sorry for him, but something needs to be done, not him being locked up in a police cell where he can be battered by some other thug, but more him being sectioned and treated.

On a slightly bright note, he did absolutely crack me up at that bus stop when a 176 came. An old lady stepped aside for him, as he'd abviously barged his way to the front of the queue. He turned to her and said "Thankyou, and you're even older than me". She struggled to keep a straight face, and it does show that deep down he has manners! :)

[Brendan]

I also felt sorry for him as the first 2 times he approached me he seemed polite and I felt bad for the guy. But after reading about the way he has intimidated people, especially women alone with their children, I feel nothing anymore.

The guy has infringed upon local peoples? basic rights to safety and freedom of movement. In my opinion that negates any rights he may have. (I know my opinion on this differs from the Law?s but the Law quite frankly is full of shit and wrong)

[Karl Hungus]

He (slim black guy, in his 20s, about 6') and another guy were hanging out at the corner of Grove Vale/Derwent Grove about midday today. He asked me for money "to buy something from the shop", but didn't persist when I politely said no and walked on. About half an hour later his companion asked me for change as I walked back at the same spot. This other chap was white, shorter, in his 40s, and had a foreign accent (could have been anywhere between Russia and Italy!). Again, took no for an answer.

However, the first time I saw the black guy was about two weeks ago, about 8.30pm, when I was out for a run. He was really intimidating an old man for money by the furniture shop on DKH. I ran over the road to intervene, but luckily by the time I got over the old man had escaped into the take-away. This guy's body language was so aggressive that I had my door key ready in my fist - I was very glad that I didn't have try to make him leave the old fella alone by force.

He's so obviously got mental health problems and/or a crack problem, I just hope he gets the help he needs before someone gets hurt. Maybe if we report seeing him dropping a cigar...

[karter]

The guy that Karl describes was asking people in Filmnight for money last night at about 7pm, the staff did nothing . As i was walking out he he came up to me put his hand on my shoulder and asked for some change to buy food, I told him i had no change which was true, he had a vacant look in his face and slight redness in his eyes and yes i felt sorry for him too. Five minutes later i walked out of Threshers and guess what, he passed at the same time and he asked me the same question. He didnt seem threatning and as i felt sorry for him, i gave him 24p, he said "god bless you sir" and then moved on and asked the people at the bustop across the road.

Some of us may have pity for this guy but the local fuzz or wardens don't seem to be doing anything about this guy begging just yet.