Incident Somerfields (Lounged)

[SteveT]

A man caught at 'it'

got a few slaps by the bullying staffers at Somerfield

and a knicking.

Some say he got what he deserves, some say "appalling"

I say "that'll teach him not to be a crappy thief" he'll be able to improve himself and his techniques when he is inside, (working for Her Majesty) with all the other crappy thieves.

[Tony.London Suburbs]

Loz Wrote:

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> Tony.London Suburbs - if you look out the window

> and find someone who looks like Mike Tyson's

> bigger brother trying to break into you car. What

> do you do first? a) punch him in the mouth or b)

> kick him in the goolies??

....NEITHER! I would say "Can I help you in any way,SIR?" and empthasize the "Sir"...

>

> Summary justice only 'works' (and I use the term

> lightly) when you are a lot bigger and/or

> outnumber the person in question, really, doesn't

> it? When that doesn't apply, the bravado ain't so

> strong.

....True but its good to fantasise though,innit?...innit?:))

[Asset]

Louisa Wrote:

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> Asset what a load of b*llox! The growth and

> acceptance of the 'underclass' in this country is

> a result of an over friendly welfare state and

> do-gooder middle class people, like yourself, who

> allow them to get away with murder(or

> shoplifting)!!

>

> Louisa.

But I thought you championed the WC Lousia.

Anyway I'm really going to resist getting into this one with you again but suffice to say - you know not of what you speak.

[SteveT]

Louisa wrote: who allow them to get away with murder(or shoplifting)!!

Like Barry George a Louisa, who was released after nine years with 'err sorry guv our mistake', from the desperate police.

They topped James Hanratty the A6 murderer but they gave him a posthumous pardon, so thats okay then.

The most dangerous people on this planet are those who are convinced they are completely right, and there is no room for any untidy errors or doubts, I'm sure you must have a little bit of doubt that you just might be wrong.

Eh Louisa?

[Louisa]

Asset Wrote:

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> Louisa Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Asset what a load of b*llox! The growth and

> > acceptance of the 'underclass' in this country

> is

> > a result of an over friendly welfare state and

> > do-gooder middle class people, like yourself,

> who

> > allow them to get away with murder(or

> > shoplifting)!!

> >

> > Louisa.

>

>

> But I thought you championed the WC Lousia.

>

I stated an 'underclass' created by people with views and opinions like yourself who work in government and legal institutions throughout this country. Working class people of the tradition I was brought up in did not steal despite the often awful conditions many of them lived in, they knew that they had to work to get themselves out of poverty. Your claim I know not of what I speak says an awful lot about your ignorance Asset. I've been there and seen how these people deal with things and I can assure you people like you just make it worse. But not to worry, carry on living in your own little middle class dreamland of utopian society where violence doesnt exist and criminals should be given double beds in prison and allowed to roam our streets taking from everyone else who works. Oh until something awful happens to you and then you change your tune.

Louisa.

[bigbadwolf]

Does Somerfield franchise out it's chain as this seems the only realistic reason as to why the shop manager would want to send out such an aggresive message to those thinking about pinching his stock. To an extent I agree with Louisa that shoplifters should be made to feel unwelcome but I can only go so far as support man handling them out of the shop for all to see, not punch them in the face and throw them to the floor and then take them out the back. What astonishes me is why they made such a public issue of it especially in an area such as east Dulwich, not exactly the sort of place who's citizens would support a lynching compared to Conservatine constituencies in the home counties. I can only conclude that those carrying out the beating of the shoplifter who in this circumstance appear to be lacking security i.d, either badge or uniform must be shelf filling staff. Also, if willing to carry out such a task that is very different to the duties they are paid to carry out then they must be very simple minded as well. If you worked in that capacity and your manager asked you to beat up a shoplifter in front of the customers in broad daylight with the added risk of prosecution(not to mention they may be armed, even though restrained) through witness statements would you go through with it. Their actions speak for themselves, idiots.

[Louisa]

SteveT accidents do happen and no one is perfect, but I think comparing some of the most horific historical crimes which were badly handled to a shoplifter is taking it a little too far. The police and others can only go on what they are given and I think it is dreadful that innocent people were put into prison and it is right and just that these people, such as Barry Geroeg, are given compensation and a chance to get back to a normal life. But let us not forget that in the case of Jill Dando her murderer is still out there to this day, her family cannot grieve properly without bringing this person(s) to justice, which is sadly looks like may never happen. Let us not forget those who are the victims in the first place, as I said about the shoplifter scenarios earlier.

Louisa.

[AcedOut]

Louisa, you do speak a whole load of twaddle, don't you! Turning this into a class debate, honestly...

[Louisa]

AcedOut, I think I have some very valid points here, class affects every aspect of day to day life. The gentrification and yummyfication of ED has gradually eroded traditional working class culture and therefore shoplifters who would once have been rightfully tackled if they were threatening people now find themselves put on a pedastal by do-gooder yummies with three wheeled prams popping into Somerfield to buy some organic corn flakes and to report innocent workers to the authorities for doing their job. It's astonishing the lengths these middle class people will go to destroy this area.

Louisa.

[AcedOut]

The law is the same no matter what class you consider yourself Louisa...

[HonaloochieB]

I went to Somerfield this evening, and at ?5:00 for 4 66cl bottles of Cobra lager I felt as though I was stealing from them.

None of the staff assaulted me, though.

[Mellors]

Sadly they don't sell organic cornflakes in Somerfield, and the aisles are a bit narrow for a 3 wheel pram. Now, if only we had a Waitrose or M&S food...

[????]

er, didn't forensic tests show that James Hanratty WAS the A6 murderer Steve? Plenty of other examples but I think you chose the wrong one

[HonaloochieB]

???? Wrote:

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> er, didn't forensic tests show that James Hanratty

> WAS the A6 murderer Steve? Plenty of other

> examples but I think you chose the wrong one

Actually ?4:00 I think Hanratty might have been strung up on the basis of having a surname with a rodent in it. The word 'rat' I mean, not of course a living vermin lodging in his partonymic.

One can't help but speculate that if the judge at the time was more of a fan of Wind In The Willows it might have gone a bit easier on him.

You never know, do you?

[SteveT]

Quids having googled I stand corrected,............ I think?

[SimonM]

It was Timothy Evans who was pardoned

[SteveT]

Thankyou SimonM I could not remember his name, although I had thought of the case.

[Ace77]

Having been burgled this year I have no sympathy towards the shop lifter.

[Cassius]

Louisa Wrote:

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> AcedOut, I think I have some very valid points

> here, class affects every aspect of day to day

> life. The gentrification and yummyfication of ED

> has gradually eroded traditional working class

> culture and therefore shoplifters who would once

> have been rightfully tackled if they were

> threatening people now find themselves put on a

> pedastal by do-gooder yummies with three wheeled

> prams popping into Somerfield to buy some organic

> corn flakes and to report innocent workers to the

> authorities for doing their job. It's astonishing

> the lengths these middle class people will go to

> destroy this area.

>

> Louisa.

Come on now Louisa - I see where some of your earlier comments were coming from, but these comments are totally ridiculous. NO-ONE is putting the shoplifter on a pedastal - in fact only Snorky said that there might be legitimate reasons for theft if the thief was desperate. I am sure that somewhere in law is the concept of 'reasonable force' and it sounds from the OP that more than reasonable force was used in this case.

And as for the comment that middle class people are trying to destroy the area - words fail me! I have lived in ED for nearly 20 years and although I don't celebrate the opening of every shop, the place has far more to offer than it did then.

Why would anyone wish to destroy the area they live in? The influx of new people is changing the area not destroying it - the changes may not suit you, but you are not the only person living in ED.

[JohnL]

The law has to be respected IMHO

If the law said 'take him to Peckham Square and thrash him', then I'm OK with that, otherwise we'll end up living in a second Iraq.

[Louisa]

Cassius where is the evidence to suggest more than 'reasonable force' was used? And even if it was, are we going to rely on the words of a couple of people who post on a message board rather than waiting to find the actual cause, surely this great legal system is in place to look at the CCTV footage as well as take witness statements. I am not going to accept that more than resonable force was used at this stage because WE DO NOT KNOW. This is what gets to me, the fact that we do not know all the evidence and people are already jumping to the conclusion that the criminal was in the right and the security staff were in the wrong, it is a mentality I find astonishing I have to be honest here.

Louisa.

[ianr]

Louisa Wrote:

> WE DO NOT KNOW. This is what gets to me, the fact that we do not know all the evidence

> and people are already jumping to the conclusion that the criminal was in the right

What criminal? :)

[SeanMacGabhann]

Just please stop louisa. I repeat no one on here is saying how the criminal was in the right. Apart from snorky. Who. . Unless im mistaken is no middle class elitist. So stop. Saying. It !

Please

This whole debate has been debased by your false accusations and twisting of arguments. Not to mention playing the class card. Predictably.

You are correct about one thing. None of us are in full possession of the facts. Ergo we rely on the law of the land.

[*Bob*]

ianr Wrote:

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> Louisa Wrote:

> > WE DO NOT KNOW. This is what gets to me, the

> fact that we do not know all the evidence

> > and people are already jumping to the conclusion

> that the criminal was in the right

IanR wrote:

> What criminal? :)

Nice one, Ian.

Sorry, Louisa.. you lose.

[Brendan]

I would rather get a kicking from a few rent-a-cops than suffer this thread any longer.