Chavs on dirt bikes

[EDLove]

Louisa Wrote:

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> Otta brilliant point you make. Working-class kids

> would not be able to afford such bikes in the

> first place, and yet it is assumed by many on here

> that they had to be working class or "chavs"

> simply because of the sort of anti social

> behaviour they were taking part in. Why would it

> be inconceivable to suggest that some middle-class

> white boys who attend a private school were not

> riding recklessly around the streets on bikes. And

> if they were, would that behaviour still be

> described as "chav" - I don't think it would. It's

> classic class discrimination that's what it is.

>

> Louisa.

Why do you think a working class person wouldn't be able to afford a bike?! Slightly patronising. Working class children can work and save up for things too, just as many middle-class children are expected to do.

[Seabag]

Or maybe they have stolen these bikes

And I believe the Police have a non-chase/pursue policy, and these bikes are being favoured by youfs, even in Sydenham btw (gasp)

And on we go, tra laa la

Basically, ar%e holes risking other peoples safety (class/socio groups aside)

[Louisa]

EDLove, I don't presume that at all. But it seems a less likely proposition than a middle-class teen getting mummy or daddy to buy them one. And yet, no-one makes the presumption it was someone of a privileged background despite the odds being in favour of that? Bizarre. Would you describe a private school educated child/yummy mummy/city gent/ hipster on a bike as being a "chav"?

Louisa.

[root]

Louisa Wrote:

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> EDLove, I don't presume that at all. But it seems

> a less likely proposition than a middle-class teen

> getting mummy or daddy to buy them one. And yet,

> no-one makes the presumption it was someone of a

> privileged background despite the odds being in

> favour of that? Bizarre. Would you describe a

> private school educated child/yummy mummy/city

> gent/ hipster on a bike as being a "chav"?

>

If they were wearing tracksuits, bandannas and doing wheelies on pavements yes. Had they been doing wheelies on pavements wearing suits I would have probably used some different but more derogatory term.

[Otta]

I just read on a sydenham forum that yoots are having races up and down Kirkdale in the middle of the night. Clearly not just an ED problem.

[StraferJack]

Louisa

A plumber on 40k a year

An office worker in a suit and tie on 16k a year

Which one (or both? Or neither?) is working class?

[Louisa]

SJ the plumber is clearly the better off one in this instance, but he/she may well send their children to a government funded school despite the wealth and be strict with their kids on being spoilt. Is he still middle class or working class? The 16k office worker may struggle to pay rent but still enjoy a 9/17 quid burger from a street food van on north cross market, are they still working class? There are of course boundaries, but my point is one of my mentioned people who would classically fall into the "chav" category would clearly be neither of the above, and yet they would immediately be accused of illegally riding bikes on the pavement.

Louisa.

[ultraburner]

Louisa, did you actually see the guys on bikes that this thread is about?

[Louisa]

No ultraburner I did not and I wish I had done now because I would have shouted at them. I'm just not sure why people have to brand them "chavs" regardless of who or what background they came from,driving on the pavement is illegal. I do not understand why people are immediately branded class offensive words on this forum based on the behaviour they have shown in a public place. They are scum regardless of their background, branding them "chavs" is just a horribly cringy thing to do.

Louisa.

[StraferJack]

Louisa. I really think you are deranged sometimes

There is no argument you can't twist. If a guy on 16k a year buys a 6 quid burger what does that have to do with anything and class?

[ultraburner]

No Louisa, riding on the pavement on a powerful dirtbike is "just horribly cringy"

The label you want to apply to the people that do this is irrelevant.

Who or what you blame for this is your issue; you have got it the wrong way round.

[Louisa]

SJ but I was just using that point to illustrate it's not as clear cut as you might first think. Someone who works in Canary Wharf in an office on 16k who decides they want to spend 5-20 quid on a burger is clearly deranged anyway, but if they choose to do so that's upto them, however, if they are then mirroring the fancy burger eating middle-class snobbery to get equal pleasure from jumping on a lambretta and driving it around ED on the pavements does that make them a "chav"? that's my point.

Louisa.

[ultraburner]

Makes perfect sense that.

[StraferJack]

Still not getting it

Someone who spends a couple of quid more to have a burger taste of something AND lessen chances of eating some disease ridden horse off cuts is deluded? AND middle class ( albeit maybe wannabe?)

[Otta]

But class isn't just about how much you earn.

But middle/working class is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY too simplistic as your example highlights.

[Louisa]

God why is everyone picking on me tonight. All I am saying is, if anyone from whatever class background jumps on a bike and rides it on the pavement they should immediately be dealt with by the law. Their class does not come into it. However, on this forum, the offensive "chav" word is used widely and loosely to describe them. This word, as everyone knows, is used to describe people from a certain social class. That was my original point. Therefore, without knowing any of the details, we are immediately led to believe these idiots on bikes driving them dangerously on our streets are people from a working or "under" class background. All I'm saying is, for various reasons they may be from any class background, why are they branded anything other than just complete morons in the first place?

Louisa.

[alice]

is chav a shortened form of a longer word? if so whats the word?

[StraferJack]

Honestly, I post a dozen tiiiiny little posts invoking class, prejudice and generalisations... One or two people challenge me and BOOM!!! "Everyone" is having a go at me

Tcha

[Louisa]

SJ I rarely if ever go down the class route these days. But on this occasion I thought it was relevant. Use of the word "chav" is just offensive in this context. We all agree these people are idiots, let's just drop the use of the word chav. I do however stand by my point about expansive burgers. Paying the best part of a tenner or more for one burger is ridiculous. As is a coffee for more than 1.50.

Louisa.

[StraferJack]

Dems the rools people. No need for further discussion

[miga]

.

[root]

I have just entered the twilight zone ...

[alice]

or maybe chauvinist

[Otta]

Louisa I wasn't having a dig at you earlier, I was really commenting on SJ's plumber and office boy.

[LadyDeliah]

Nigello Wrote:

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> LD: you might not recognise yourself as such, but

> you are part of that elite you disparage. You're

> well educated, in professional employment,

> articulate and computer literate. Even if you

> don't take part in the so called enrolment of

> "chavs" and certain other groups as whipping boys

> by the layer of society you pillory, you're still

> part of that group, at the tippety-tip-top of the

> pyramid.

Hmmm, part of the elite?

I got a law degree from a former poly when I was a 41 year old single parent of 4 kids living in a council house.

Plus I'm violent (done martial arts for pretty much all of my adult life).

I guess that means I'm a chav (Council house and violent).

I am pretty far from being part of the elite and even if I wasn't, it didn't stop Tony Benn from critiquing their role in exploiting and controlling the masses.