Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Too big , old and slow to run away.


when 3 young lads decided to de-money me in Camberwell, I used the theory, " hit the biggest first" , so I attacked the biggest guy, broke his nose, blood everywhere , and strangely enough the 2 little blokes wanted none of it.


having said that , my girlfriend is a lot smaller than me so i tell her just to hand the bag over if threatened, no point in being beaten up for a phone and some small change.


In this day and age , "hero's" end up with a knife in them.

and the perps end up on youtube showing off.

Sorry to ehar of your experience


the only real self defence is to leg it and start screaming as you do so - muggers rarely chase people down


Its a bit sad though - this type of act is a dead cert bang up offence - how wasted & pointless must your life be to carry out a street robbery for a pittance & a bauble or two ? when you could end up losing much of the next couple of years out of citrculation if you get caught


The value system behind this kind of act is twisted. A despareate skaggie / crackie may be expected to carry out a rash act like this, but these kids are unlikely to be skaggies just yet


The risk / reward odds are so stacked against the muggers, it is surprising that they still go on with it - there is a lack of clear thinking involved - if it was about money, then finacial fraud would be much better odds and more lucrative

The risk / reward odds are so stacked against the muggers, it is surprising that they still go on with it - there is a lack of clear thinking involved - if it was about money, then finacial fraud would be much better odds and more lucrative


or maybe just a lack of any kind of actual thinking..........

Sad to hear this mlewis,

I hope you & your boyfriend are ok. I know from experience that these traumas can last days months & even years.


Such a terrible assault. To just Beat up your boyfriend for no reason other than personal Gain.


What would drive young men to do this?


My thoughts are that this runs deeper than just a mugging & that its questionable if its possessions Or money they are really after.? I would say Status & ego Run a higher reward for these people.

Gangs are a breeding ground for Hate crimes against un-armed & easy civilian prey.

These Hoodlums are probably unaware of their wrong doing & plotting their next attack on the defenseless.

A description is useless, as if they swarm in a group, how would you be able to select one individual out from the crowd.

The White bandanna is a sure sign of a gang in that area, Who seem to attack with violence. Sickening.


One day a real rain will come & clean the streets of this scum.

my flatmate reported this to the safer neighbourhood team - 0208 721 2447. Obviously at 3am this was a recorded message but they rang back on saturday to collect the info for the statistics. Frustrating that the only upshot was another number on a list, but they did appreciate the call as i guiess if it reaches a certain threshold they allocate more resources.

mlewis- im sorry to hear about what happened to you and your bf. i hope the scums get whats coming to them.


in regards to fighting back or running away, a few years back i was on my way home (this was at camberwell new road and about 8pm in the evening) and just as i was about to step of the kerb, i felt a tug at my back (i was carrying a rucksack) and before i knew it was being dragged on the floor 3-4 meters from the kerb. i was being attacked by 3 boys while a 4th stood watch.


during the whole time this happened, i kicked, screamed, punched until 2 cars pulled over and ran to my defense. the attackers legged it and i was left shaken and still with my rucksack.


once i was at home (one of the saviours was a black cab man and drove me the rest of the way home) the shock was overwhelming and it took me a while to get over the incident. in hindsight of course i should have given them what they wanted. but as it was happening, i had no time to think, i couldnt even register what was happening as i was being dragged on the floor, all i knew was something kicked in and it was a basic survival reaction of being attacked.


sometimes there leaves no time to think about what to do. wrong or right.

The OP did respond to the request for a description on page 1 of this thread with the following



"to be honest it all happened so quickly it's hard to give a really good description. but you're not far off bigbadwolf, they were quite young, early 20s, no hoodies but one was wearing a bandana (black and white we think) which the police said sounds like one of the local gangs, baggy low slung jeans etc. it was all very scary and intimidating. they looked like they were just wandering the quiet streets looking for something to happen, and it certainly felt like it wasn't the first time they'd done it. they ran off up dunstans road (towards forest hill end), which is the direction they initially came from."

James Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Still waiting for a description...


If you re-read the original post there isn't very much of one.


What will you do with it - even if a description worthy of a Nobel Prize for Literature was posted up here surely it's a police matter?


Some tips (print out and keep):


Be careful when walking around late at night

Report any suspicious incidents to police

I agree that people should stop harassing the OP for a description. She did her best.


But what are you on about with this, ?What will you do with it - even if a description worthy of a Nobel Prize for Literature was posted up here surely it's a police matter...??


If they are local kids people may know them and they could then go to the police.

Brendan Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------


>

> If they are local kids people may know them and

> they could then go to the police.



How good would that description have to be, in order to actually have a hope in hell of identifying someone?


Clothing descriptions are useless - If I mugged someone in my distinctive Girls Aloud hoodie I'd probably retire it for a few weeks.


Skin colour description is useless - Unless the perpretrators happened to be bright green, in which case they'd stand out a bit.


Unless one of the kids had a head as big as a basketball and a 15 fingers I'd say it's futile posting anything on here.


There's hundreds of groups of kids around here. Many of them harmless. All you're encouraging is members of the public to become paranoid of everyone. A lot of them are already. It doesn't help.

Chill out Lenk FFS, I don't think anyone is trying to encourage paranoia!


I don't think anyone on here is naive enough to believe that every teenager in baggy trousers and a hoodie is going to be carrying a knife, but the fact is, that some do, and as Brendan points out, if someone did know who this particular gang of little scrotes are, then maybe reporting them would be useful.


Do you not think?

James, to be fair to Lenk, I don't think s/he ever said a description would be useless. However, the OP has already said she doesn't have a particularly helpful description, and just saying "gang of black/white youths in t-shirts and jeans" isn't really going to help you recognise a potential threat.
For god's sake. The people asking for a further description want to know one thing - were they BLACK or WHITE. They want to be able to nod their heads and think their racist sterotype was correct if the answer is black or sit back and raise their eyebrows in surprise if told they are white.

How about this bizarre scenario SCSB79?


Perhaps the people who want to know a description want to know in case, for example, they are walking home late and see the persons described. Then they know to get the hell out of there.


Extreme, bizarre and far-fetched I know! Gosh, how silly of me to suggest such a thing!


No; of course not. In truth we are all card-carrying fascists. That's far more likely.

Keef Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> to be fair to Lenk, I don't think s/he ever said a description would be useless.


Lenk Wrote:

> Clothing descriptions are useless...

> Skin colour description is useless ...


Sorry to state the obvious but the Police offer up a description of criminals to assist them and others in finding them, one reason is that it may jog someone's memory. A description also helps rule out innocent people. It's helped the people before on the forum, last year a group of three or four girls, one in a white puffa jacket were attacking other kids in the area, a description of them on here helped people contact the SNT who later found these girls and dealt with them.


As far as I know attackers, like the ones mentioned on here, do not have a different set of clothes for every day of their lives so clothing descriptions help too. Saying that giving out accurate descriptions of attackers is useless is silly.


You can report any "non 999" incidents to the Safer Neighbourhood Team (SNT) on 020 8721 2447

Keef Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> to be fair to Lenk, I don't think s/he ever said a description would be useless.


Lenk Wrote:

> Clothing descriptions are useless...

> Skin colour description is useless ...



Smartarse! ;-)


Well out of context though, and you know it.

James Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> How about this bizarre scenario SCSB79?

>

> Perhaps the people who want to know a description

> want to know in case, for example, they are

> walking home late and see the persons described.

> Then they know to get the hell out of there.

>

> Extreme, bizarre and far-fetched I know! Gosh, how

> silly of me to suggest such a thing!

>

> No; of course not. In truth we are all

> card-carrying fascists. That's far more likely.


You're suggesting that members of the forum would be inclined to remember some useless fragments of description of some unspecified menace when out for the evening?


That's a big ask.


Why not simplify the message to 'if you're walking around South east london after dark you should be careful'?


Because that is probably just as effective.


Please don't start beating the usual 'PC' drums again everyone, it's skin-crawlingly uncomfortable to read once you all get going.

I think your weird attempts to justify your squeamish PC instincts are skin-crawlingly uncomfortable actually Lenk.


I don't know who you think you are helping either. Certainly none of the mostly disadvantaged black men who are shot or stabbed on the streets of London every year. Perhaps you should involve yourself actively in a charity or something, rather than going on witch-hunts on forums like this to demonstrate how politically correct you are.


Dunno who you mean by "you all" as well... now who is being prejudiced and jumping to conclusions?


I read a description of three female muggers on here a while ago. I remembered it and looked out for them. Thankfully I didn't encounter them. I'm at a loss to understand why you find the usefulness of a descrition so hard to grasp Lenk.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Latest Discussions

    • The is very low water pressure in the middle of Friern Road this morning.
    • I think mostly those are related to the same "issues". In my experience, it's difficult using the pin when reporting problems, especially if you're on a mobile... There's two obvious leaks in that stretch and has been for sometime one of them apparently being sewer flooding 😱  
    • BBC Homepage Skip to content Accessibility Help EFor you Notifications More menu Search BBC                     BBC News Menu   UK England N. Ireland Scotland Alba Wales Cymru Isle of Man Guernsey Jersey Local News Vets under corporate pressure to increase revenue, BBC told   Image source,Getty Images ByRichard Bilton, BBC Panorama and Ben Milne, BBC News Published 2 hours ago Vets have told BBC Panorama they feel under increasing pressure to make money for the big companies that employ them - and worry about the costly financial impact on pet owners. Prices charged by UK vets rose by 63% between 2016 and 2023, external, and the government's competition regulator has questioned whether the pet-care market - as it stands - is giving customers value for money. One anonymous vet, who works for the UK's largest vet care provider, IVC Evidensia, said that the company has introduced a new monitoring system that could encourage vets to offer pet owners costly tests and treatment options. A spokesperson for IVC told Panorama: "The group's vets and vet nurses never prioritise revenue or transaction value over and above the welfare of the animal in their care." More than half of all UK households are thought to own a pet, external. Over the past few months, hundreds of pet owners have contacted BBC Your Voice with concerns about vet bills. One person said they had paid £5,600 for 18 hours of vet-care for their pet: "I would have paid anything to save him but felt afterwards we had been taken advantage of." Another described how their dog had undergone numerous blood tests and scans: "At the end of the treatment we were none the wiser about her illness and we were presented with a bill of £13,000."   Image caption, UK pet owners spent £6.3bn on vet and other pet-care services in 2024, according to the CMA Mounting concerns over whether pet owners are receiving a fair deal prompted a formal investigation by government watchdog, the Competition and Markets Authority (CMA). In a provisional report, external at the end of last year, it identified several issues: Whether vet companies are being transparent about the ownership of individual practices and whether pet owners have enough information about pricing The concentration of vet practices and clinics in the hands of six companies - these now control 60% of the UK's pet-care market Whether this concentration has led to less market competition and allowed some vet care companies to make excess profits 'Hitting targets' A vet, who leads one of IVC's surgeries (and who does not want to be identified because they fear they could lose their job), has shared a new internal document with Panorama. The document uses a colour code to compare the company's UK-wide tests and treatment options and states that it is intended to help staff improve clinical care. It lists key performance indicators in categories that include average sales per patient, X-rays, ultrasound and lab tests. The vet is worried about the new policy: "We will have meetings every month, where one of the area teams will ask you how many blood tests, X-rays and ultrasounds you're doing." If a category is marked in green on the chart, the clinic would be judged to be among the company's top 25% of achievers in the UK. A red mark, on the other hand, would mean the clinic was in the bottom 25%. If this happens, the vet says, it might be asked to come up with a plan of action. The vet says this would create pressure to "upsell" services. Panorama: Why are vet bills so high? Are people being priced out of pet ownership by soaring bills? Watch on BBC iPlayer now or BBC One at 20:00 on Monday 12 January (22:40 in Northern Ireland) Watch on iPlayer For instance, the vet says, under the new model, IVC would prefer any animal with suspected osteoarthritis to potentially be X-rayed. With sedation, that could add £700 to a bill. While X-rays are sometimes necessary, the vet says, the signs of osteoarthritis - the thickening of joints, for instance - could be obvious to an experienced vet, who might prefer to prescribe a less expensive anti-inflammatory treatment. "Vets shouldn't have pressure to do an X-ray because it would play into whether they are getting green on the care framework for their clinic." IVC has told Panorama it is extremely proud of the work its clinical teams do and the data it collects is to "identify and close gaps in care for our patients". It says its vets have "clinical independence", and that prioritising revenue over care would be against the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons' (RCVS) code and IVC policy. Vets say they are under pressure to bring in more money per pet   Published 15 April 2025 Vets should be made to publish prices, watchdog says   Published 15 October 2025 The vet says a drive to increase revenue is undermining his profession. Panorama spoke to more than 30 vets in total who are currently working, or have worked, for some of the large veterinary groups. One recalls being told that not enough blood tests were being taken: "We were pushed to do more. I hated opening emails." Another says that when their small practice was sold to a large company, "it was crazy... It was all about hitting targets". Not all the big companies set targets or monitor staff in this way. The high cost of treatment UK pet owners spent £6.3bn on vet and other pet-care services in 2024 - equal to just over £365 per pet-owning household, according to the CMA. However, most pet owners in the UK do not have insurance, and bills can leave less-well-off families feeling helpless when treatment is needed. Many vets used not to display prices and pet owners often had no clear idea of what treatment would cost, but in the past two years that has improved, according to the CMA. Rob Jones has told Panorama that when his family dog, Betty, fell ill during the autumn of 2024 they took her to an emergency treatment centre, Vets Now, and she underwent an operation that cost almost £5,000. Twelve days later, Betty was still unwell, and Rob says he was advised that she could have a serious infection. He was told a diagnosis - and another operation - would cost between £5,000-£8,000.   Image caption, Betty's owners were told an operation on her would cost £12,000 However, on the morning of the operation, Rob was told this price had risen to £12,000. When he complained, he was quoted a new figure - £10,000. "That was the absolute point where I lost faith in them," he says. "It was like, I don't believe that you've got our interests or Betty's interests at heart." The family decided to put Betty to sleep. Rob did not know at the time that both his local vet, and the emergency centre, branded Vets Now, where Betty was treated, were both owned by the same company - IVC. He was happy with the treatment but complained about the sudden price increase and later received an apology from Vets Now. It offered him £3,755.59 as a "goodwill gesture".   Image caption, Rob Jones says he lost faith in the vets treating his pet dog Betty Vets Now told us its staff care passionately for the animals they treat: "In complex cases, prices can vary depending on what the vet discovers during a consultation, during the treatment, and depending on how the patient responds. "We have reviewed our processes and implemented a number of changes to ensure that conversations about pricing are as clear as possible." Value for money? Independent vet practices have been a popular acquisition for corporate investors in recent years, according to Dr David Reader from the University of Glasgow. He has made a detailed study of the industry. Pet care has been seen as attractive, he says, because of the opportunities "to find efficiencies, to consolidate, set up regional hubs, but also to maximise profits". Six large veterinary groups (sometimes referred to as LVGs) now control 60% of the UK pet care market - up from 10% a decade ago, according to the CMA, external. They are: Linnaeus, which owns 180 practices Medivet, which has 363 Vet Partners with 375 practices CVS Group, which has 387 practices Pets at Home, which has 445 practices under the name Vets for Pets IVC Evidensia, which has 900 practices When the CMA announced its provisional findings last autumn, it said there was not enough competition or informed choice in the market. It estimated the combined cost of this to UK pet owners amounted to £900m between 2020-2024. Corporate vets dispute the £900m figure. They say their prices are competitive and made freely available, and reflect their huge investment in the industry, not to mention rising costs, particularly of drugs. The corporate vets also say customers value their services highly and that they comply with the RCVS guidelines.   Image caption, A CMA survey suggests pet owners are happy with the service they receive from vets A CMA survey suggests pet owners are happy with their vets - both corporate and independent - when it comes to quality of service. But, with the exception of Pets at Home, customer satisfaction on cost is much lower for the big companies. "I think that large veterinary corporations, particularly where they're owned by private equity companies, are more concerned about profits than professionals who own veterinary businesses," says Suzy Hudson-Cooke from the British Veterinary Union, which is part of Unite. Proposals for change The CMA's final report on the vet industry is expected by the spring but no date has been set for publication. In its provisional report, it proposed improved transparency on pricing and vet ownership. Companies would have to reveal if vet practices were part of a chain, and whether they had business connections with hospitals, out-of-hours surgeries, online pharmacies and even crematoria. IVC, CVS and Vet Partners all have connected businesses and would have to be more transparent about their services in the future. Pets at Home does not buy practices - it works in partnership with individual vets, as does Medivet. These companies have consistently made clear in their branding who owns their practices. The big companies say they support moves to make the industry more transparent so long as they don't put too high a burden on vets. David Reader says the CMA proposals could have gone further. "There's good reason to think that once this investigation is concluded, some of the larger veterinary groups will continue with their acquisition strategies." The CMA says its proposals would "improve competition by helping pet owners choose the right vet, the right treatment, and the right way to buy medicine - without confusion or unnecessary cost". For Rob Jones, however, it is probably too late. "I honestly wouldn't get another pet," he says. "I think it's so expensive now and the risk financially is so great.             Food Terms of Use About the BBC Privacy Policy Cookies Accessibility Help Parental Guidance Contact the BBC Make an editorial complaint BBC emails for you Copyright © 2026 BBC. The BBC is not responsible for the content of external sites. Read about our approach to external linking.
    • What does the area with the blue dotted lines and the crossed out water drop mean? No water in this area? So many leaks in the area.
Home
Events
Sign In

Sign In



Or sign in with one of these services

Search
×
    Search In
×
×
  • Create New...