Saila

.. because we have a decent vaccination program in place whereas sadly some developing countries do not http://www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs286/en/ Key facts Measles is one of the leading causes of death among young children even though a safe and cost-effective vaccine is available. In 2010, there were 139 300 measles deaths globally ? nearly 380 deaths every day or 15 deaths every hour. More than 95% of measles deaths occur in low-income countries with weak health infrastructures. Measles vaccination resulted in a 74% drop in measles deaths between 2000 and 2010 worldwide. In 2010, about 85% of the world's children received one dose of measles vaccine by their first birthday through routine health services ? up from 72% in 2000. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Measles is a highly contagious, serious disease caused by a virus. In 1980, before widespread vaccination, measles caused an estimated 2.6 million deaths each year. It remains one of the leading causes of death among young children globally, despite the availability of a safe and effective vaccine. An estimated 139 300 people died from measles in 2010 ? mostly children under the age of five. Measles is caused by a virus in the paramyxovirus family. The measles virus normally grows in the cells that line the back of the throat and lungs. Measles is a human disease and is not known to occur in animals. Accelerated immunization activities have had a major impact on reducing measles deaths. From 2001 to 2011 more than one billion children aged 9 months to 14 years who live in high risk countries were vaccinated against the disease. Global measles deaths have decreased by 74% from 535 300 in 2000 to 139 300 in 2010

Measles, a viral respiratory infection, killed over 500,000 children in 2003, more than any other vaccine-*preventable* disease. The measles death toll in Africa is so high ? every minute one child dies ? that many mothers don't give children real names until they have survived the disease. Measles weakens the immune system and renders children very susceptible to fatal complications from diarrhoea, pneumonia and malnutrition. Those that survive may suffer blindness, deafness or brain damage. http://www.unicef.org/immunization/index_why.html There are some issues in life which are shades of grey... For me, vaccinating against measles isn't one of them.

I absolutely agree emotional risk / benefit plays a role too I dont find it difficult to imagine the huge regret and grief I'd have at seeing my child suffering from a potentially devastating disease that I could have prevented. For me, these awful emotions would far offset the emotion of say the pain of an injection, or the injection reactions, that you get with a vaccination.

'Natural immunity' only works if the first time you come into contact with the virus (or whatever) it doesn't kill you/blind you etc. Which is fine for relatively harmless bugs But if talking about more serious bugs, a helping hand, in the form of a very small, harmless, dose, is an alternative. The resulting immunity is a totally natural process but just given a little kick start so we don't have to suffer the harsh consequences of an initial infection. So if you weigh up the risks of autism (which has been proved to be non-existant) with the risks of blindess (proven and well known side effect of measles for example) you'd come to the conclusion surely that a vaccination was a rational decision? It is to me anyway

what Ruth says times a million

.. does anyone have an opinion of center parcs? would that be a good option if a flight is not possible?

dulwichgirl2 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Just to echo the general delight, hurrah! What a > phone-call. I imagine YOUR heart was pounding. Yes it was. The conversation was painful!

i just got my result back - been given the all clear genetically! so far so good. Obviously i have to wait for the cardiac scan before we can breath a full sigh of relief. even so - very good news. phew

Great. The department sounds excellent. What does nicolaides look like? The name's all over my notes but I saw so many doctors I'm not sure who was who... Edit to say: decided not to go to harley st. Sounds like a waste of time and I'm already in the best hands. Thnx for tips.

thanks for all your reassuring comments re Kings - I think you're absolutely right. When things go wrong, Kings is the best place to be and I wouldn't choose anywhere else. I guess going to HS is a choice that i will go ahead with if the CVS shows 'nothing is wrong'. that way i can get new reading of nuchal tranlucency. Not becuase i think kings got it wrong, but more that perhaps the umbilical cord was making it come out worse... i know this is clinging on to false hope, but if there's any chance the reading was exaggerated then it's worth that extra scan imo. Just seeing it myself again may help the news sink in too. my scan pictures look like the text book examples of extreme problems... google images look exactly like my scan...

hello I've had a dodgy scan at 12 (well actually 13 weeks as i'm apparently more pregnant than i thought i was) weeks My nuchal translucency measured on average 3.5 mm with one reading at 4mm. I then had my bloods and my hcg result came back as 2.5 MoM I've done enough research to realise this is not good. This thread is a 'is there anyone else out there who's been through this?' question rather than a 'what would you do' question. I'm 34 yrs old. I'm going for a second opinion next week at Harley st private scanning and i did a CVS as soon as i got these results. I'll hear the outcome on wednesday. It's either genetic abnormality or cardiac defect or it's nothing and these readings are just unlucky.... It's upsetting, especially as i'm showing and everyone knows i'm pregnant, but i guess it's just one of those things life throws at you. I'd be keen to speak with anyone who's been through this though, as it can make you feel a bit lonely. thanks edit to ask if anyone knows what the cut off age for a D&C is at Kings? I heard that each hospital has a different policy and i dont want to even consider the medical induction option if possible...

This thread was mildly amausing when it was slating estate agent's language but now seems to be openly criticising someone's home? They didn't ask for this? Feels a bit mean to me I think it's a lovely house -

GM is everywhere - RUN FOR YOUR LIVES

Hmmm Thanks for all the tips and advice. I'm aware I sound a bit moany and pathetic. Birth is tough, fullstop, for everyone. I shouldn't complain as I came away with a healthy child in the end. Anyway. This was just to get some tips to try and prevent a repeat of last time. The tips have been very useful - so thnx again. I've just made an appopintment with kings midwife to go through my notes. I'm sure that'll help.

I have it but still not found time to read it! :)

Thanks I requested my notes soon after the birth and have them at home with me. Not much was written down about my labour as no one was looking after me. They were all written up post birth by a midwife whose name I never found out. I wrote about 15 drafts of letters of complaint, but they were so long and rambling I never managed a final draft. The letter extended to my after care, when I found myself secretly hiding under my bed covers and syringe feeding my son cos I couldn't bear watching my limited breast milk being poured down my sons face and wasted. Syringe feeding was brilliant and what my bf counsellor suggested but wasn't 'ward policy' so (and I prob shouldn't say this) I was sneaking up to special care, where he had previously been, and stealing the syringes etc needed and literally hiding under my covers feeding him for fear of being caught. Crazy. Then my missed episiotomy infection and the midwife who suggested I try herbal remedies to sort the infection out... Then finally they mistakenly gave me a second course of hardcore antibiotics when I was discharged. So I was on them for 15 days instead of the normal 7 days. This really helped the thrush... As soon as I finally came off the antibiotics I was struck down by double mastitis within days. I must have been very worn out. I ended up formula feeding after just getting to a point of no return and totally giving up.

i've spoken to someone in contact with the victim. She is still recovering at home but getting better quickly. the 3 men were in fact boys. She thinks school children around 14/15 years old range....

good plan on the notes - although they are pretty sparse as no one was officially looking after me. So not much was written down. thanks again for advice

Saffron - I was and am very fit and healthy. Not problems during pregnancy etc. The infection came about 2 days post birth. I was in hospital at the time. I knew there was something wrong but again, sadly, was fobbed off and told it was normal to hurt the way it did. But it didn't feel right. I was finally diagnosed with infection on day 5 and was put on incredibly strong antibiotics. This triggered thrush and struggled to pump so that I could beaker feed my son in special care with breast milk. God - it was such a nightmare. SW - I had a ventouse last time and thought it was great! I know I'm not meant to say that, but it got my son out quickly and safely. So ventouse has my vote. Helpful to know the infection thing is out of my control as I can imagine stressing about that as and when it happens again. For me, the fact my birth felt so completely out of control and I was so very alone, in huge pain and scared which gave me huge anxiety and outright depression for a longtime after the birth. Plus a great feeling of anger and bitterness for being made to feel so weak and vulnerable. All these medical alternatives feel much more appealing. I'd feel like I was actually being helped and monitored which is exactly what I want and why I want a birth in hospital. I know this view is unusual but it's how I feel. I'm really angry about the whole thing tbh.

amydown Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Salia, I wonder if our toddler was in the same > class as your son. The kids used to get hugely > distracted by the cat! Big can of Coach Sophie and > Denzal though. We gave up too in the end and now > go to JAG every now and then. Agreed that LK can > be a bit too structures for little ones. He he! Yes you probably were with us. The coaches were both fantastic. We were just too young for it... It was exhasuting and draining for us!

Thanks very much SW I was definitely past epidural stage by the time my partner found me on the floor. Although he still asked for one as that was my only brief to him before the birth (demand an epidural!) But I knew it was too late at that point The receptionsit midwife just didn't believe I was progressing and Kept saying I was 1cm dilated without even checking She just kept dismissing me and saying I'd be in labour well after she'd gone off shift. She was very wrong. From all the feedback I've had from nct and friends, I have to say asking for an epidural seems to always be resisted when I first went into labour I said I wanted an epidural at some point, the midwife just bragged about how all her births were natural that day. As if to say she didn't want to break that run of luck. Grrrrr. Do you have any tips on infection prevention? Would my steps make a difference?

Just quickly on the episiotomy infection thing. Is it as simple as insisting on being 'cleaned' With anti-septic before any cut is made? Or is it more complicated than that? What about being completely clean shaven etc? Sorry for tmi but just wondered if steps like that Would make a difference? Also, how frequently can your cervix be 'checked' in terms of dilation without causing more risks? I was told no more than 1x every two hours? Is that bollox? What's the kings rule for admission in terms of contractions? Is it 3 in ten definitely? My labour was actually relatively quick (6x hours) albeit with just reception staff monitoring me... But is it true epidurals could lengthen the process? If so I'd much rather have a longer less traumatic birth Than my last one Finally, what is the dilatiion 'allowed' for epidural at kings? And can I measure it myself? I don't wanna be fobbed off with 'you're not dilated enough-bullshit' Excuse language... Slightly bitter

Ps Thanks fuschia/edanna for advice and tips

Great, I'm not worried about episiotomy itself. In fact i'd rather that than risk an uncontrolled tear. It's just the infection I found debilitating. So understanding how to reduce that risk of infection is important to me. My last experience was dreadful (laboured on my own in the loo of antenatal ward, partner sent home despite being in labour, begged to have him back, when he arrived he found me pushing on my own on floor by my bed, finally got to labour ward, the baby was in distress, I never had midwife care, straight to doctor who told me I had one push to get him out, episiotomy, ventouse, infection and special care for hoim - all in disaster) Asked for epidural all the way thru but was refused. Will pm you Thanks!

dont go too young to L.K. our son was useless - took more interest in the cat that occassionally makes an appearance, than kicking a ball. we gave up in the end