When and why did ED become so poncey?

[mockney piers]

Doh!!!

[*Bob*]

Obviously if it were true "Mrs" *Bob* and I would be down the local reg. office for a cheap-n-cheerful I do quick-smart.

[david_carnell]

You don't have to oay any council tax if your property is used as the base for a religious order recognised by the state. Become a monk, turn your house into an abbey and your weekly bin collection is now a freebie.

I am now to be addressed as "Brother David".

;-)

[alachlan]

brilliant!

[Keef]

Agree completely that a person with a second home should pay full amount for it!

[Brendan]

Considering the current housing crisis people with a second home should pay more for it.

[iamyamyam]

I seem to remember that the Lib dems want to replace the council tax with a local income tax. To me this seems much fairer. If you have 3 wage earners in a house then you contribute more than than a pensioner living on their own. Old people can be left with a "valuble" property but no income. We dont ask the people who live nearer the coast to pay more for the Navy ergo....

[Michael Palaeologus]

I get about a 25% reduction for being on my tod. A 50% reduction would be nice.

[EDDW]

iamyamyam Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I seem to remember that the Lib dems want to

> replace the council tax with a local income tax.

> To me this seems much fairer. If you have 3 wage

> earners in a house then you contribute more than

> than a pensioner living on their own. Old people

> can be left with a "valuble" property but no

> income. We dont ask the people who live nearer

> the coast to pay more for the Navy ergo....

The problem with the Lib Dem model is that deprived areas / regions generate low revenue as the majority of families tend to be low income. Thus they have less to invest in services that such areas need - good schooling, work generation schemes, strong social support services - which perpetuates the area as a low income / deprived area.

It may be that "poll tax" models are like democracy - the worst form of govrernment except for all the rest.

[JoeChuff]

Couples don't receive a 50% discount.

Also council tax isn't about paying money to receive services. Try ringing pest control if you're a private tenant - it's not available. Like most taxes, it is a bribe from the rich to the poor, to stop them from rising up and killing us.

[ChavWivaLawDegree]

So I should be arguing to scrap it altogether.

Viva la revolution!

[citizenED]

Following on from CWALD "solutions" -

Scrap income support and provide a universal benefit for every adult. This should be a minimal "living amount". Everyone gets it no matter whether employed or not. This should ease the poverty trap where it is not worth the poorest people working because what they earn is off-set against benefit giving them no incentive to work. Then, if some people were prepared to live on the minimal benefit, so be it. Most people wouldn't. It might help prevent some people getting involved in the black market too.

It would also stop the Authorities having to chase benefit fraudsters. Instead they can go after the real cheats - tax dodgers.

citizen

[ChavWivaLawDegree]

Big round of applause for our citizen there.

Totally agree! You should join the green party mate!

[tommy]

That's smart - if people with second homes have to pay council tax (or more) on the property - won't this just be passed on the tenants ?

[citizenED]

I don't think anyone's suggesting that landlords pay council tax on their rented accommodation, simply people with two properties, ie one they live in and a holiday home or a pad in town for their own use, should be taxed at the same, or even higher rate.

citizen

[*Bob*]

The difficulty with the council tax is that, from what I can see, it can't make its mind up. Is it a tax on property or a tax on people? It seems to be a bit of both, which is why I can understand anomalies like the second home thing. You can't be in two places at the same time, so it would be unfair to tax equally on both properties seeing as council tax 'pays for the use of local services', even if the way the tax is worked-out is based on property.

I realise second homeowners are a dirty word in this thread, but it's not like they don't get clobbered with tax anyway (ie stamp duty).

At least you knew what the poll tax was for and why you were paying it (or, er, refusing to pay it as the case may have been ha ha). It's the lack of clarity which makes things difficult.

Personally, if you believe in a system where the better-off contribute more (which I do) then I think the LibDems local income tax idea is probably the fairest system on offer, though I might be less enthusiastic if/when the bill arrived.

[ChavWivaLawDegree]

I think in theory a local income tax could be a good thing, but it would be the same poor mugs shouldering the tax burden, while the wealthy pay for people to avoid it. I think the nice idea about a property tax, is that it's a bit difficult to hide a house so the owners would just have to cough up.

[*Bob*]

We already have a property tax.. stamp duty.

And what about people who own a house but who don't have much cash?

[Louisa]

That's a good point *bob*, it's fine taxing the super rich, but many people are sat on a fortune but still live very basic lives. This country is great at taxing ordinary people to the hilt and offering nothing in return. I know many people who have been forced to sell up their homes because of Inheritance Tax, and it's not nice.

[Brendan]

"Our team of experts has decided that Income Tax has not proved popular with the public and will therefore be abolished. It was started in order to finance the Napoleonic war in 1799 and we now believe that the time is right to announce the cessation of hostilities with Napoleon. Some of the money left in the coffers will be used to fill in our part of the Channel Tunnel in case no one has mentioned it to the French. Any remaining money will be strategically placed on a horse at the 3-30 at Haydock Park at odds of at least 12/1 in order to see us through until the next election. Income Tax will be officially replaced by people lending the government a bob or two at the end of the week when we?re a bit skint."

- Official Monster Raving Looney Party Manifesto.

Hopefully this will settle it.

[Jeremy]

> lending the government a bob or two at

> the end of the week when we?re a bit skint."

They already do that, it's called a bond.

The lounge beckons.

[Louisa]

I dont understand why this thread was not lounged long ago, it's gone off onto around 4 or 5 big topic areas.

[alachlan]

Louisa - many people do unfortunately have to sell their homes or look for ways of financing an IHT bill, but with some fairly simple planning in advance most people can avoid such problems (by most people I mean all but particularly large estates, and even there most liabilities can be avoided).

[*Bob*]

Alachan - yes indeed.

Perhaps instead of spending zillions of pounds every year printing useless glossy 'advice' sheets (in 22 languages) for things that make no difference to your life, her Maj's government could provide a few genuinely useful tips such as to how to avoid hundreds of thousands of quid going to the taxman.

Oh yeah.. maybe not.

[alachlan]

Hence why such information is so difficult to come by and cumbersome to pick through. But frankly that's a good thing or we'd have even more taxation to deal with.