Your views on Foie Gras

[DJKillaQueen]

I'd ban battery chickens too though and some dairy farm practises...so no disagreement there....

But I have yet to hear anyone who eats foie gras justify the inhumane process of production. At least a chiken can be grown, fed and lay eggs in other ways. Foie Gras can't.

[Loz]

katie1997 Wrote:

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> (Going off topic, cannot believe I'm discussing rights to

> eat foie gras locally when I hear about the famine in Somalia) :(

Thanks for the inadvertent reminder, Katie. Saw that on the lunchtime news and promised myself to send some dosh to the DEC appeal. Just remembered to do it after I saw your post.

http://www.dec.org.uk/ if anyone else would like to join me in sending some help Somalia's way.

[Otta]

For the record, I don't think battery hens have feeders to flock to. I think it is a large trough (so?) that is constantly topped up by machine, and they keep going to it, because that is their life.

Not good, I know.

Don't see one as better or words than the other though, and suspect you do strafer, simply because you're a well known good snob, who probably wouldn't touch dirty chicken with your worst enemy's barge pole.

[maxxi]

DJKillaQueen Wrote:

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>

> But I have yet to hear anyone who eats foie gras

> justify the inhumane process of production.

Why should they? Can anyone justify the slow suffocation of a cod caught by a trawler? Or the cruelty and suffering (FACW) of a beast slaughtered to satisfy religious requirements? Can they justify asparagus flown in from Chile during the winter months?

What about our European cousins and their taste for Ortolans (now illegal to sell in France but not to eat). To get the traditional flavour these tiny birds are captured alive, force-fed, then drowned in Armagnac and roasted whole then eaten that way, bones and all.

Sounds terrible - but I'd love to try one... even though I could not "justify" it.

ETA: though illegal it is only so because of numbers dwindling (not cruelty) and it is now a protected species along with woodcock but it is still caught and eaten and even - allegedly - served in some restaurants to favoured clients.

[Alan Medic]

maxxi wrote

Now that is bollix. Tom has been nothing but friendly on this forum and not idiot enough to think he could pull the wool over your eyes regarding his eating habits. Where did he even imply he was not against meat? He may not persuade ED to give up meat but he might have hoped to make an impact on some people regarding FG. You should apologise to him.

[maxxi]

Tom has been nothing but friendly on this forum and not idiot enough to think he could pull the wool over your eyes regarding his eating habits.

so why not state his intentions to eradicate all animal slaughter (or 'living free from animal products' as the Vegan Society he is a member of states) at the start?

Where did he even imply he was not against meat?

The use of the collective 'WE' as in we're all in this for the same reasons - now THAT is bollix.

he might have hoped to make an impact on some people regarding FG.

He was trying to pressurize a local business to conform to his ideals and wanted support.

Apology refused.

[Alan Medic]

Well up yours then!

[Otta]

Wow, chill people.

[maxxi]

Alan Medic Wrote:

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> Well up yours then!

Okay watch the old BP - if it upsets you that much I apologise to all vegans everywhere and will smear myself in Marmite and prostrate myself on a bed of ricecakes before them, and when they heave their wracked translucent frames to the barricades surrounding Au Pied de Cochon I shall support them with a song in my heart.

*and a trotter in my hand*

[Frankito]

Not wanting to get involved, but I will anyway... Alan, I don't think it'syour right to tick someone else off about a response they gave to another poster. Now if you are a moderator I understand and bow however, if not, leave them to it and let the debate continue. I don't see anything over the top in any of the opinions shared until you stepped in as angry Dad.. Saying up yours to anyone is simply childish, oh, and abusive!

This one is for you: >:D<

[Alan Medic]

Ah sod off Frankie. I didn't have time to write an essay. maxxi said bollix first.

[Alan Medic]

I suspect you don't mean that maxxi. Anyway I'm not looking for an apology nor to give one. Tom deserves credit for raising this subject and provoking a debate on it.

[dita-on-tees]

I may be wrong on this but battery farming is being banned in the UK - intensive battery farming has to be phased out though - so farmers have had time to make other arrangements - I was on a farm in wales were they had one of the new hen coops - they're big and they have outside roaming space whenever they want and it was a reasonable amount of outside space - more than I have in my shite london flat... I make be wrong on all this and been spun a farmer's yarn...

I have no time for veganism tonight, I have just had a quorn stirfry - because I am on a diet not because I have any concern for animal welfare (I just dont and I am too knackered to pretend to be a better person) It was fecking rancid, so if someone offer me a nice bit of warm sourdough (I can provide the starter) with a large smear of fois gras and maybe some plum chutney I might break. or weep. or both.

[maxxi]

Alan Medic Wrote:

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> >

> Ah sod off Frankie. I didn't have time to write an

> essay. maxxi said bollix first.

I did - but at least I provided a tasty recipe for them.

[maxxi]

Alan Medic Wrote:

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> >

> I suspect you don't mean that maxxi. Anyway I'm

> not looking for an apology nor to give one. Tom

> deserves credit for raising this subject and

> provoking a debate on it.

I am sorry if it upset you but how can I apologise to 'Tom' without taking everything I said back? I stand by everything I said re little Tommy.

[DaveR]

If anybody is organising a pro- foie gras campaign, I'm in.

And if anybody is organising a 'please bugger off all self-righteous killjoys' campaign, I'm up for that too.

[Mick Mac]

Tom is a bit "holier than thou". Its his personal opinion that he is trying to enforce by stopping the supply.

He would be much better to try to educate people and ask them if they still had the appetite for fois gras, knowing the raw facts/have seen some evidence...dont assume everyone knows or has seen how it happens

I think someone caompared this to battery chickens - but its much worse IMO - a steel rod stuck down each duck's throat a number of times, no doubt painfully, shooting food down into their stomachs as they struggle, a farmer grabbing them by the neck. Disgusting.

I'll never eat it again.

[aquarius moon]

Mick Mac wrote

" He would be much better to try to educate people and ask them if they still had the appetite for fois gras, knowing the raw facts/have seen some evidence...dont assume everyone knows or has seen how it happens "

Tom is trying to educate people.

Unfortunately it is falling on deaf ears, because a lot of people don't want to be educated.

They prefer to turn a blind to the suffering & would rather not know, for fear of being put off their sunday lunch.

I don't know how anybody in their right mind can encourage the horrendous cruelty involved, by continuing to eat it, once they have learned the facts.

I can't even bring myself to watch the video 'Force fed to death' on Mick Macs post, because I already know how bad it is.

If you do want to be educated, I suggest you watch it.

There is more info on the Viva website

http://www.viva.org.uk/mediareleases/display.php?articlepid=253

[binary_star]

Thanks Mick Mac for posting that video. I can't watch it all though - scrubbed to 2.15 and now

I feel sick. I won't eat it. Talk about barbaric, no wonder their gullets get torn.

Edited to correct video time and typo

[aquarius moon]

binary_star Wrote:

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> Thanks Mic Mack for posting that video. I can't

> watch it all though - scrubbed to 4.15 and now

> I feel sick. I won't eat it. Talk about barbaric,

> no wonder their gullets get torn.

Yes, thanks Mic Mack for posting this.

Hopefully, other people will feel the same way as binary star.

[The Minkey]

I know there are those who disagree and will defend their right to eat foie gras, however, there is a good reason its production has been banned in many countries including Israel which was the third largest producer after France and Hungary.

"To produce foie gras, birds are restrained and a metal pipe is shoved down their throats and into their stomachs. A massive quantity of corn is pressure-driven down the pipe, often causing a rupture of the bird's stomach or esophagus, leading to a very slow and agonizing death. The force-feeding takes place as many as 4?5 times a day for a month, causing the liver to become diseased and swell from 2?3 ounces to 1?2 pounds. At that point, the goose or duck is slaughtered and the fatty, cholesterol-laden liver is removed and sold as a delicacy."

http://www.chai-online.org/en/compassion/foiegras/food_foiegras.htm

I don't eat foie gras because it's a product that requires the systematic torture of animals to make it, but whatever floats your boat..

[david_carnell]

Ah yes.....video evidence. Marvellous stuff. I've watched it - but I'm so immune to animal suffering due to my previous careers as badger gasser and mink furrier that it has no effect on me.

God, it's like those awful pro-life people who will try and show you images of foetuses - you either believe in it or not. Imagery shouldn't be the deciding factor.

Of course we could eat ethical foie gras, right?

Tastes like crap though. Now, ortolan....that's where the action is. I'm trying to breed chaffinches to satisfy the French market but the buggers keeping flying away. I'm going to start breaking their wings at birth.

Anyone for chihuahua flan?

[Jeremy]

aquarius moon Wrote:

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> Tom is trying to educate people.

That's exactly the problem.

Almost everybody who eats Foie Gras already knows what it is, and how it's produced. They don't need "educating" - they already know the facts, they just have a different opinion.

[binary_star]

I dunno d_c, I always knew how it was produced, but watching it is a different experience altogether. Not sure I could physically stomach it now after watching the video.

[Loz]

Most videos produced by animal rights groups are carefully edited to show any process at it's worst. That's not to say the fois gras process is sweetness and loveliness - it's not. But I can pretty much guarantee that if you watch any video of an abattoir at work - even a non-animal rights one - you will feel a little queasy. Who watched the Gordon Ramsay programme when he raised and then slaughtered a pair of pigs? Who looked away at the fatal moment?

Picking up your sealed tray of meat from your local supermarket, you are entirely divorced from the process and most people are happy in not knowing. Chicken processing lines, especially, would make most people wince. These days we kid ourselves and console ourselves that the animal we are chewing on 'had a good life'. Even seen a cow get a bolt or a bullet to the brain? Ever seen a fish die of suffocation? If the fois gras process makes you uncomfortable then you should really question any meat you eat - anything else risks a degree of hypocrisy. Maybe you should take the time to visit an abattoir. Or even just go fishing.

Anyway, for balance, here is a video of the traditional fois gras production process. And here's another that

. Still not for the faint of heart, but these, at least, haven't had the Viva "shock! horror!" treatment.