The war memorial at Dulwich Common

[citizenED]

I go past it every day on my way to work. It's looking much, much smarter. The memorial and flagpole have been pcleaned up and there is some work being done round the base.

[macroban]

There is a two-page article about the War Memorial in the Autumn 2008 edition of The Dulwich Society Newsletter.

[Lawyerlady]

My daughter and I went along to the re-dedication ceremony and she subsequently wrote about it for a nationwide competition for 14 - 16 year olds organised by the Imperial War Museum and Commonwealth War Graves Commission . We have just heard that she has won a won a place on the 'Away to Remember' visit to the First World War battlefields of France and Belgium to commemorate the 90th anniversary of the Armistice.

Well done to all involved in the renovation project.

[Jah Lush]

Well done to your daughter Lawyerlady and well done to the people involved in the renovation. I went past it yesterday and it's looking very spick and span.

[Lewis]

Just a quick update on the Memorial. Firstly if anyone wants some photos of the ceremony we held a couple of weeks ago I can supply some rather good ones taken by the Council's photographer, I know some people came from outside London so they might want a memento of the event. I have already discussed with the cadets and peckham perkster applying for some further funds next year, two ideas are to restore the small railings by the pavement and provide an appropriate plaque or noticeboard by the memorial where we could put a full history of the Battle of High Wood and the Dulwich Volunteers. I think this has been a fantastic project and I hope this will prompt works to other memorials in the borough as I would not be suprised if there are others that are in need of some restoration.

I hope that you'll be able to join us for Remembrance Sunday.

My e-mail is [email protected] for photos.

Lewis

[JeffJames]

Something more to say concerning the First Surreys. There is a First Surrey Rifles Asssociation and on the Sunday we were at Dulwich Common they were at St Giles' Camberwell holding a remembrance service. They also visit the Somme and perhaps those interested parties should get to-gether with them.

The Commonwealth War Graves Commission has sent me a list of casualties for the 15th September 1916 and they number 134 officers and men. I also have an additonal list for the remainder of the war. There is a discrepancy in the numbers given by the Commonwelth War Graves Commission and some other publications which I will look into.

In additon to Thiepval, there are First Surreys at Adanac Military Cemetery, Miramount,Somme and Caterpillar Valley Cemetery,Longueval,Somme. Lambeth Council hold the archives for the First Surreys and by entering landmark.lambeth.gov.uk First Surrey Rifles a selection of those archives can be viewed.

I have asked Southwark Council to put the names of the fallen or at least the name First Surreys on the memorial at Dulwich Common. My uncle was a bandsman with the First Surreys and he survived the war.

[Peckhamgatecrasher]

Having hurled a brickbat at the Council on another thread, well done this time. And many thanks to all the locals who were involved.

[JeffJames]

Additonal to my previous, the list of cemeteries for the First Surreys should include Warlencourt British Cemetery, Pas de Calais. There is also a Rifleman James Mace listed at Arras Memorial, Pas de Calais. Rifleman Mace was from the 2/21st Bn and not the 1st/21st Bn. The 2nd battalion was not in the order of battle for High Wood but he died on the 15th September 1916 and could have been in one of the companies. If that is the case then the total of officers and men killed on th 15th September will be 135.

[macroban]

Southwark News report.

[Applespider]

Just thought I'd let you know that all the hard work is being noticed. I've heard a few people on the 185/176 in the morning comment on the 'new' memorial that's appeared when the bus has been stopped at the lights.

[jaytyger]

As far as I know the 1st Surreys names are on/in St Giles Church as that is where the memorial to the 1st/First Surreys is, as their barracks were in Flodden Road,Camberwell, SE5. The ceremony held each year at St Giles, used to be attended by ex serving members of the FSR but the torch is now held by the FSR Assoc.Which is a non profit making organisation, dedicated to the memory of the FSR.(it costs a couple of pounds to join) They go to High Wood after the 15th because they always attend the service at St Giles. The Fusilers from Tooting attend High Wood every year and lay wreaths and normally take a band for the parade at High Wood.

The 2nd Battalion, 2/21st Battalion County of London Regt.(First Surrey Rifles) did not serve on the Somme, as far as I know, but went from Arras to the Middle East, before being disbanded in 1918, the 1/21st Batt.were disbanded in 1919. The 3/21st was a draft finding Battalion and did not leave Camberwell, also disbanded in 1918.

[JeffJames]

I have prepared some notes on the First Surreys and the action at High Wood. I have visited the Lambeth Archives and the National Archives at Kew. In addition there are several good websites which give supporting versions. I have put to-gether a composite picture of events that day 15th September 1916. I have freely copied from other sources to achieve this and have taken care to list acknowledgements and extracts. This has been a private and non-commercial effort. I was simply intrigued and concerned that so many men became casualties that day. To quote,' the actual operation had not lasted more than an hour or so, and the ground covered was not more than one mile, but in this short space the First Surreys suffered more heavily than in our months of previous fighting'. No individual First Surrey, is mentioned in my notes. However, I would like to pay tribute to the battn medical officer Capt.H. H. Robinson RAMC and his stretcher bearers.

If you would like a copy of the notes I will e-mail them to you.

[northerngrit]

I've been reading this account with great interest. I have just completed researching the 264 Old Boys of Alleyn's School who were killed during the First World War and listed on the School's honours boards. If you'd like to see a summary of the research, go to www.edwardalleynclub.com where the item is currently on the home page. I shall soon be working on finding out more about the 113 Old Boys who were killed in the Second World War. It's an on-going exercise so if anyone has any further information or comments, please do let me know.

[knackered cow]

This is why I like the Forum-

A really nice thread! I would love to support this!

[peckham_perkster]

Hello, I'm down from Brum this weekend so I can go to the war memorial to observe the silence. I have just come on here to bump the thread in case anyone else would like to join us.

This will be the first Remembrance Sunday since the renovation so is quite an important one for the memorial and the men it was built in memory of.

[High Wood Barracks]

Dear Jeff,

May I have a copy of your notes you compiled from your research regarding the 1st Surreys engagement on 15 Sep 1916 please. I am the commanding officer of Dulwich Air Cadets.

Many thanks.

KEVIN MEHMET

Flight Lieutenant

Officer Commanding

1475 (Dulwich) Squadron ATC

[email protected]

[JeffJames]

In The Dulwich Society Autumn Newsletter No.158. There is an article covering the origins of the Remembrance Memorial which is both relevant to honouring the war dead as well as in the future development of the area by Southwark Council. I have been in touch with The First Surrey Rifles Association and through their Hon Secretary their committee have indicated that 'the historical connection of FSR with High Wood barracks is minimal'. They go on to say,' this is especially since for the last 83 years we have held our annual church parades at St Giles Church Camberwell where we have had a memorial chapel and our war memorial'. However, they go on to say that 'High Wood is very much in the mind of the High Wood cadet centre, which is commemorated in their Squadron Badge'. The Remembrance Memorial was for the Dulwich Volunteer Battalion 'it may have been a conduit for The 1/12th County of London Regiment [The Rangers], see the Newsletter. The battle for High Wood could be argued as the start of modern warfare where for the first time massed artllery, tanks and planes were used to-gether. There is much to remember and wonder at and I hope any information board erected by Southwark will reflect the original purpose of the Memorial and the bravery of a 'Citizen Army' on the 15th September 1916.

[SE22_164]

A memorial board with the names of the members of the St. Peter's congregagation who lost their lives in WWI was moved from the builing to St. Clement's Church on Friern/Barry Road.

[JeffJames]

Thanks for this info.

I have the casualty list from the Commonwealth War Graves Commission for The First Surreys 1/21st and The Rangers 1/12th. I would like to match the names on the list with those on the various war memorials around Dulwich.

Could I ask all of you out there for some help.

When you next pass a church or a war memorial can you make a list of the names and where it is located and e-mail it to me.

e.g. I believe there is a plaque outside the sorting office in Sylvester Road. If you can photograph it as well then all the better.

From that information, we can build a list of where the memorials are located and the names inscribed. I doesn't matter if they are not First Surreys or Rangers.

Jeff James

[peckham_perkster]

Just a quick update. Some clients from the Southwark Youth Offending Service have been doing some gardening work at the war memorial and have planted bulbs which should come up at the end of spring. They will return later this year to do some more planting and sowing of seeds so the area should really start looking full of life.

[peckham_perkster]

Hello me again. Another update, and this time a quite impressive one. There Council had an underspend on the Cleaner, Greener, Safer fund last year of ?7k and the councillors have all agreed for this to be allocated to the Dulwich War Memorial!

This will pay for a noticeboard by the memorial explaining the history of it and sorting out the railings and masonary.

If I hear anymore then I will let you know. :):)

[Peckhamgatecrasher]

That's brilliant news.

[macroban]

Good news.

Thank you for the update.

[macroban]

A tangent to the main thread:

M.R.D.Foot in his autobiography "Memories of an S.O.E. Historian" (2008) says that on 3 March 1939 he was posted to the 35th Searchlight Battalion of the Royal Engineers (Territorial Army) which had been formerly been the 1st Surrey Rifles, 21st London Regiment. In March 1939 the unit had two drill halls: dull yellow brick, cold and draughty buildings in Flodden Road, Camberwell, and a brand new building in Lordship Lane, Dulwich.

Was the 1938 or early 1939 new drill hall on the High Wood site or elsewhere on Lordship Lane?

[Townleygreen]

Macroban,

My guess would be that the new building was High Wood barracks - if I remember correctly(!), it was a 30s style building - it had metal casement windows I think (though they could have replaced somehting older).

I wonder if anyone has a photo of the barracks?