fazer71

~We definitely don't want any more housing!~

taper Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > It's a dreadful junction. Will this junction be wonderful after the money and changes? Ummmmmmm Southwark council as ever.... If it's not broken spend lots of other peoples money to fix it be sure not to fix what is broken.

Green Goose Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Yes, we got played for mugs by the Tooley Street > cadre. > > We can console ourselves at the forthcoming > election. How? Labour have such a following in Southwark they'll never be replaced... Unless We all vote UKIP lol ... What a mad system ... We're just mugs ... run by mug voters .. and dogma .

Hard standing creates problems with rain water having nowhere to go and will result in potentially impossible to deal with flooding. Think Noah if this goes on we will all need an ark. Allowing dropped curbs and giving people the ability to park of street is also elitist and will make those who can do this even more advantaged over the poor who live in flats with no access to parking of any form it's obviously an elitist scheme devised by the capitalist political elite outrageous as this is raised as an issue now just ahead of the election this thread is being used as political propaganda for the non socially elite. If the poor can't have dropped curbs.. Then neither should the rich... Dropped curbs for all!!!!!! Power to the people .... http://the-militant-atheist.org/images/noahs-beaver-problem.jpg

Yea kill the dropped curbs .. They allow people to part of road should be made illegal. Outrageous letting people have a drive to park their cars on. Road to moon parking way better than that madness.. ;)

Most people have given up the will to live having been ground down by the process. The professional political system will always beat us idiots. Where did I put that book on knots? +---+ | | 0 | /|\ | / \ | | =======

The insane language of meetings in order to sound impressive without ever truly saying what they mean. Like it?s a win-win situation when we actually know that it?s a win-lose one. These sneaky weasel words affect every aspect of our lives. Any fool can take something complex and make it sound difficult. It takes courage and leadership to cut through the bullshit and reduce tough problems to their simplest elements ? and to then reach clear, understandable, occasionally unpalatable decisions based on common sense. Like... If it's not broken don't f?&ing fix it!

It all about the money... forget anything else this is insane ...

Socialist just more fantasy fairy tales as who is surprised ?

I've got IT OPTION 11 A roundabout with raised platform Zebra crossings surrounding it. See Goose green roundabout similar layout similar traffic peaks etc "only this one would be safer with the raised zebras" for school kids should work well for buses cars cyclists mopeds choppers people with or without cats dogs prams skateboarders people with silly walks and aliens. I really don't understand why there's any need for some special cyclist BS and traffic lights.

Yes it's about time the schools started helicopter flights into their sports fields. Knuckle heads.! After all that is what people with Chelsea tractors expect isn't it private jets and choppers to school? Anyway to reality. People need to get their kids to school ... This thread is about a junction. What are they going to do about the ?285k for making zero difference. Gold plated buttons on the pedestrian crossing. If it's not broken they will break it so they can fix it again. The money merry-go-round.. Of our tax money.

You do all know this junction would work perfectly as a mini roundabout with zebra crossings on each road ... But that's toooooo simple for tfl Southwark and the suppliers of traffic systems. Hehehe.

From what I discovered through my solicitor when looking to buy a house on the Dulwich Estate. Dulwich Estate has total control over any / all developments though they can't unreasonable withhold any reasonable application. But where it comes to their own developments, if they wanted they could technically built a skyscraper a la Shard without asking anyone for permission they have total planning rights on their own land. In practice they would be unlikely to do that as they might get away with it once it is likely parliament would step in and change the rights they have if they did so. Southwark conservation / planning are just a formality though the Estates applications tend to be designed to meet Southwark planning guidelines as they don?t want to unnecessarily push their luck. My solicitor believed. Dulwich Estate is a law unto itself. The buck stops only with an act of parliament. Best to expect failure you will then not to be disappointed when they build a load of ugly housing. See the two Joke Houses on Court Lane !

I still don't see any benefit in changing the junction other than putting back the two lane exit from Townley rd. I believe that all road users are fully familiar with the existing layout cars cyclists children etc . After years of using this junction we are all fine. My fear is any major changes will result in increased risk to the most vulnerable and is more likely to result in our worst fears! This all appears to be an experiment at great cost to the tax payer for the benefit of nobody other than the contractor and keeping Southwark staff busy. If it's not broken don't fix it! If it needs tweaking then tweak. Such major surgery with unknown outcome or what appear to be worst outcomes makes absolutely no sense. Besides this being a license for Conway to print money. It is a potential killer not a life saver due to users having to adapt to major changes!

Duvaller Great idea but that isn?t the real problem The issues run deeper that disclosure of cost it?s the actual costs. There is a basic loss of control over costs and reality. The UK public sector has an comical inability to calculate cost (basic maths) those who spend our money appear to have absolutely no understanding of basic maths. In a possible breakdown of the work required. 1. The number of workmen ( we all see the workers usually there?s a maximum of 6 usually 2 working over a period of say a month a maximum of 30 work days.) If they earn ?250 a day each (I doubt they do) that?s ?45,000 2. Materials (?20,000 or so for kerb stones hardcore and tarmac) say ?40,000 max. 3. Reuse of the traffic lights etc ( re-program a day ?250 by a man with a pc) 4. Worst ways a total of ?85,250 for the actual work. 5. Which then gives ?134,750 of the ?220,000 budget to pay for management wages backhanders for what appears to be a rather large profit ?..? Maybe they pay their workers ?1,000 a day? So numbers are what ever the contractor can get away with ? Southwark appears to have the choice of on a couple of contractors who take it in turns to give the best fake low high price. It's criminal ? No wonder we tax payers pay two to five times the going rate for everything. Central government are little better paying ?30million to ?60million for a mile of motorway quite insane! In Spain Road costs (average prices): Building: Conventional road: ? 3M/km. Motorway: ? 4M/km. Over/underpasses: ? 700/m2. Maintenance (annual cost): Secondary road: ? 6,000/km. Main road: ? 9,000/km . High-capacity road: ? 18,000/km. Motorway: ? 42,000/km. Pothole repair: Between ? 35,000/km - ? 65,000/km. Cleaning: ? 45/km In the UK http://www.theguardian.com/society/2006/dec/13/guardiansocietysupplement3

Tories? Where? Realists.. Vs Fantasists... Money savings Vs Money wasting

Villager Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Reminds me of Maggie T's observation that > "Socialists always run out of other people's > money". ummm yep "Socialism a plague on all progressive humanity but being a blessing for the incurable socialist political elite". And the turkeys keep voting for Christmas. :(

Ummm yep when people get to spend other peoples money that's the ?hit that happens.

Can anyone explain why Southwark are pushing for the least feasible option? Why would they do that????

I love it yoyo junctions. Start out with a junction which works well, make it into one which is a danger then yoyo back to the First and back again and again and again and again every few years. We see this all over Southwark. Genius job creation....

The only thing we can be 100% certain of is we'll be shelling out to fix it again in a few years! Southwark staff and their brown paper envelope contractors what a bunch of skilled freeloaders!

I remember when there were two lanes exiting Townley Rd. It all started going wrong when the exit was reduced to one lane... Rocket science required here me thinks ??????? The pathetic reality of this is there are people who depend on making a living and justifying their jobs within Southwark council on the back of constant messing with the junctions, micromanaging every millimetre of every road in Southwark. ? often incompetently? speed humps, yellow lines, bell bollards, junctions the list of BS products which add nothing is endless.. whilst we suffer potholes, puddles and broken pavements all over. Remember if they don't spend the budget they get less next year and the manager of the wonky roads department may end up with fewer staff and so less responsibility and potentially lower wages. ! So bs design after bs design year after year to justify their jobs. :( But the true true sadness is that their messing and constant change is as likely to cause deaths as it is to prevent them!

Jennys Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > As I understood it at the (very > interesting)meeting yesterday, the phasing of the > lights is not an option. Transport for London will > not allow this as it will affect the buses. Please > correct me if I misunderstood what was said. I > think cameras to stop people jumping the lights > must still be an idea worth investigating. So there we have it busses can potentially kill. !!!!! I find it incredible that with thousands of similar junctions across the UK these super road traffic designers are having to spend hundreds of thousands of pounds and many thousands of hours re designing a bespoke wheel.... Insanity...

keyhole Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Good to see it's staying as it is,,,,,,considering > there are 6 schools actually 7 at least counting > Charter,and Alleyns,lower,medium and large school > drop off areas,,,we have compromised brilliantly > all this time....Leave it be people,,,,thank God > common sense prevailed..hip hip. Is that not a sign that the phasing of the lights is in some way WRONG >?>>>>>>? IE drivers are getting annoyed at having to wait so long to get through so are jumping the lights? THIS IS A MAD THREAD !!!!!!! Trying to fix something by spending ?200,000 when it probably just needs a tweak for ?100 ! Insane !