Sephiroth

I see ?they? have started the groundwork to lay the blame on it failing What was ?will be glorious? is now ?could be? Translation. ?It won?t be. It will be hot garbage and we need to get excuses in quick? Just like Norway which has the freedom to diverge from eu rules but doesn?t because the pain isn?t worth it, this whole exercise is a colossal waste of time and money to be a rule follower only where we once had a say in the rules, now we won?t. Genius. This could be a golden age, it will be up to us to make it one. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-7930155/JACOB-REES-MOGG-shine-bright-sunbeam-certainty-end-long-night-doubt.html

You might not like what I say or the way I say it - but I promise you I'm not trying to score points But nor can I just watch anyone (in this case it's Foxy - repeatedly) just post a load of objectively false nonsense and let it lie - it's bad enough this is happening. It's worse still that the same nonsense gets repeated out of the blue like this

Football matches are not predicated on the notion of NOT playing in the same league as each other If it wasn't for english fears of immigration (and all of the culture that goes with it - media etc) , brexit would not be happening

"I have absolutely no problem with Polish or Romanian builders continuing to work in the U.K." Find a pub having a brexit party on Friday Bring some EU nationals with you - see how they feel. See how you feel Because you might be ok with them - but you well know that all the people who are NOT happy with them voted leave too Unfortunate side-effect? But you're ok with that? Or a sign of something more problematic?

"Leave voters just want to get on with things and make it work. Remain voters want to talk about it for another 4 years and do nothing." No this isn't right Remainers have been asking for 4 years HOW it's going to work - we were TOLD it would be easy, trade deals would fly in and there would be no problems. This is clearly not true. There are no good options in the pipeline remainers want to avoid damaging the united kingdom. Leavers are happy to sacrifice it

?Hey man. I?m just a humble sort who voted one way. Ain?t no thing? No recognition that it?s an almighty rupture with no pretending with monumental consequences for countries like Ireland, north and south and the potential for resumption of the troubles ?Just a thing mate. Relax. Chill. ?

It wasn?t a remainer that started this thread It?s not a remainer trolling the country with 50p coins And the tedious truth facing leavers has still to be addressed by a single leaver or PM. All that is to come Just because so many people have fingers in their ears doesn?t change a thing I?m sure you?re bored by people like me Imagine how it feels from my side - you lot ?in charge? despite refusing to acknowledge reality

As for the bogus claim ?this isn?t what we signed up for https://fullfact.org/europe/ask-full-fact-eu-then-and-now/ (I love how people who claim they were lied to in the 70s weren?t lied to now. Now, they are super smart and in no way subject to misinformation. No sireee. Also. They are all on the same page. So never mind that leave reassured us we would NOT be leaving the single market before the referendum. Now we just have to accept. ?We knew what we voted for? Sure ya did. All 17 million. All on the same page. Sure

Single market wasn?t part of the original eec. But thatcher/uk came up with that idea And convinced the eu to go along with it What is it you leavers are afraid of? The world evolves. You want to reverse everything and pretend you can dictate your own rules.

Go on then. Tell us what you?re worried about? We remainers have told you what we worry about - you don?t seem to care. But you have some notion of what the eu has planned. So go on then

Cameron goes big with his ?I?ll show them. I?ll go in with my big treaty demands? Fail May: ?I?ll sign article 50 and show them?. Front page articles showing the slayer of the EU Fail Johnson: ?blueberry blib blib. Sign up to border in Irish Sea. Pretend there won?t be one. Snigger? Fail transition period ends. Any leverage (small as it was in comparison) is gone Predatory countries like usa, China and India. And new competitors like the EU? ?Well HERE is a country desperate for a deal. Any deal....? But of course. We aren?t there yet. We are STILL in the pretend stage. All existing agreements all still in place. No cause to alarm the citizens yet. But I?m sure that sweet sweet deal is just around the corner.

Exactly KK As I?ve said many times, if people like me are wrong, we end up with egg in our face and everyone is grand But if it?s not us who is wrong....

There is a reason, 4 years after the vote we still haven?t left left There is a reason right wing leave parties are saying they must not disband and they must keep pressure on Johnson Because anyone in power knows that going ahead with this, will destroy the country. You can take that as destroying the United Kingdom. Or you can take it as destroying England and the other nations economically m But everyone with access or knowledge knows. It?s bad. Like, BAD bad

Because leavers couldnt be accused of the opposite - denying anything is to do with Brexit All just a larf to some people innit. Just a larf No amount of evidence or people telling them how it directly affects them, no amount of news from Ireland, no amount of the 3 other uk countries withholding consent from English government last week - none of it penetrates.

It?s not just withholding. It?s the denial of the truth. Watching the chancellor this week leads me to believe he doesn?t understand. They aren?t withholding so much as completely oblivious. People say remainers are stuck in 2016. But it?s the government/leavers/daily mail etc repeating the same old ?they need us more than we need them. Car manufacturers. It will all be great? from the last 4 years despite it being demonstrably untrue. And of course come february it will be al ?see. Everything is fine? when we all know its a transition period with no deal looming against a self imposed December deadline

Northern Ireland alone and johnsons lies about it should give you a clue as to which way

Various extensions have allowed the country to continue with status quo. Business ramp up warnings and start lay offs but country remains in denial. Once transition is over then it will be in you. Glory or chaos

Can has been kicked down the road by governments. I don?t recall anyone predicting chaos after the election or triggering article 50 I stand by the chaos when Brexit happens on current trajectory. Ie end of Dec with little to no deal

Transition period. No one is expecting anything to change next week. As you known

Selling fruit from a stall isn?t exactly hard, is it? Happens across every country in the eu Do they have martyrs too? I fear petty English local authorities far more than I fear any edict from the eu

Imagine thinking a bunch of arseholes deliberately and knowingly leave off metric measurements as being somehow representative of a country under occupation Could they sell using pounds and ounces. Absolutely. How do other countries survive such oppression. I keep asking the question. But it isn?t oppression is it foxy. It When uk decides its own rules (briefly) there will still be maggots trying to make a point and buck the system and they will be prosecuted then too. Those metric martyrs aren?t oppressed. They are dickheads. That?s the story (Wrote the above based on memory of events. Rereading the article foxy posted I?m even less sure what he?s upset about. It?s more about bumbling uk authorities than it is eu as far as I can see) This was the case I was remembering https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/uk/2002/feb/18/2

English doddery old men banging on about rule from afar when the 3 other nations in the UK only this week rejected the governments WA, only to be ignored Repulsive

The ignorance on display from foxy is breathtaking None of what he says is remotely connected with reality But let?s ask the question anyway. Why would countries like Northern Ireland and Scotland vote to remain if what he says is true?

People seem to be pinning hopes on ?the trade deal? Boris has ruled out extension - so no trade deal or very bare bones But even with all the time in the world, uk won?t get a trade deal as good as it has now. It just won?t happen. It doesn?t have the leverage. And other countries won?t have it

"drop the pessimism and sign up to moving forward going forward. (or some other phrase)." incorrect - when people face up to the reality of what this entails, then we can start coming together. As long as leavers continue to live in denial there is no hope. What you call pessimism and doom mongering is reality