Trains cancellations - latest

[wroed]

Alan Medic Wrote:

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> I took the bus to LB this morning as two

> consecutive trains were cancelled.

Likewise, 6.55 and 7.09 cancelled. I also noted the 6.17 was cancelled so only one out of the four scheduled trains from 6.17 ran. Warming us up for next week?

Have put my first claim in and preparing to repeat the process many times next week.

[JW]

I have had an email response from Helen Hayes. Alongside the letter she has written to Claire Perry she's joined the All Party Parliamentary Group on Southern Rail. She hasn't given an indication on when meetings are taking place, or when we can expect a resolution. The only date mentioned anywhere is the terrifying 2018, stated by Claire Perry.

I agree that we need to do more to have our concerns addressed. Emailing MPs doesn't seem to be working.

[Miacis]

New timetable - all direct trains from east Dulwich/north Dulwich to Wimbledon are cancelled from Monday. These are packed already so God knows how we will get to work now.

Can change at Tulse Hill on to thameslink but that is a)unreliable and b) very busy already.

Will email Helen Hayes and Sadiq - this is just a nightmare.

My only realistic option will be overground from Denmark hill and then change at Clapham junction which is more costly.

[mikeb]

Perhaps Hadley would like to amend their planning application which notes the wealth of transport options for their proposed development at DHFC.

[traveler2]

Just checking live departures from London Bridge via East Dulwich. Here we are:

17.01: Delayed

17.11: expected 17.25

18.08: CANCELLED

[Lowlander]

traveler2 Wrote:

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> Just checking live departures from London Bridge

> via East Dulwich. Here we are:

> 17.01: Delayed

> 17.11: expected 17.25

> 18.08: CANCELLED

Yes but the 1750 is running.

[KidKruger]

Fact is this will continue unabated because it's easy to ignore / file emails.

Until the affected passengers do something and get a profile this is it.

[traveler2]

Do you work for Southern Rail?

[Nigello]

NB - This is the same as a reply I just wrote to the James Barber thread, which featured the Southern situation.

I agree it is not acceptable and I hope that heads will be banged together (bosses', politicians' and union chiefs') to get a better timetable.

It highlights - again - the lack of appropriate levels of transport provision (at least at rush hours) in SE22/15/5 etc.

I wrote to Helen Hayes earlier this year (March, I think). She passed on my queries and concerns (and suggestions, such as more buses or express versions at certain times) to Mike Brown, the London Transport Commissioner who in turn wrote back to me (via Fiona Lampard whose title is Assembly Management Manager, Government and Stakeholder Relations, Group Public Affairs (her capitals). In essence, what I learnt is that Camberwell station could be reopened but it would have a knock-on effect on other train movements and that it is being looked into; that 40s and 176s "are well used during peak periods but....below capacity as passengers can board these buses at these times. There is not sufficient demand to justify the cost of introducing more buses along the routes. The major cause of bus delays is traffic congestion, rather than dwell time at stops. Therefore an express service would not necessarily be quicker than a service that stops more regularly."

So, if you want to get in touch with Mike Brown vis-a-vis the extra pressure on bus routes given the Southern debacle, please do so via [email protected] . Why not copy in the Mayor and Helen Hayes too?

[traveler2]

Managed to get on the 18.30 for Beckenham Junction (only 1 more day of service). Train is heaving, sweaty, very packed.

[Lowlander]

traveler2 Wrote:

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> Do you work for Southern Rail?

No, but I wrote that message whilst sitting in the 1750 :)

You can see it ran here http://www.recenttraintimes.co.uk/Home/Search?Op=Srch&Fr=London+Bridge+%28LBG%29&To=North+Dulwich+%28NDL%29&TimTyp=A&TimDay=4p&Days=Wk&TimPer=4w&dtFr=&dtTo=&ShwTim=AvAr&TOC=All&ArrSta=5&MetAvg=Mea&MetSpr=RT&MxScDu=&MxSvAg=10&MnScCt=2&MxArCl=5

[Charlie Smith]

I met with Helen Hayes today at the House of Commons. Helen and I are putting together a survey asking local people if they support or oppose the cancellation of the train franchise. We are calling on the Department for Transport to take over the running of the franchise until Transport for London are in a position to run the service. When you receive the survey please complete and return as soon as you can.

Many Thanks

Councillor Charlie Smith

Labour Member for the East Dulwich Ward

[Lowlander]

It's also going to affect a load of school kids and those who travel to stations south (Wimbledon especially). Not just those who use London Bridge

[Penguinpost]

Hi Charlie, thanks for the update.

What would the time scales be for removing the franchise and have someone else run it? I would imagine this is medium term - surely this couldn't be actioned within a few weeks?

In the very short term is there anything that our representatives (council and parliament) can do to re-instate some additional peak service trains? Have Southern indicated to politicians in private how long this is expected to last? And why are they allowed to decimate our service while leaving many other services with few amendments?

[wulfhound]

And why are they allowed to decimate our service while leaving many other services with few amendments?

Money talks. Commuters from Brighton, Eastbourne etc. are paying 5x more than we are. So if there's a shortage of train crew (whoever is to blame - DfT, Southern/Govia, rail unions...), it's obvious we're going to get the short end of the stick.

Do think DfT takeover is essential though - even if it was their insistence on Southern moving to driver only operation that got us in to this mess.

Interesting write up on Inside Croydon

https://insidecroydon.com/2016/06/15/southern-failways-civil-servant-wants-to-break-rail-unions/

[Galileo]

Charlie

Whilst I'm pleased to see you and Helen taking an interest I can't see that a survey is going to be sufficient. A survey shouldn't be required to check if we are unhappy that we effectively no longer have a train service given that the one train an hour will be full by the time it reaches here. Add to that the number of people who have so far emailed MPs on the two days this revised timetable has been clearly available to us (I checked Southern's website last week and it was not possible to wade through all the different permutations to work out what the service was going to be so I turned to National Rail which showed the current - non-emergency timetable). Imagine how many more emails will be received by the end of Monday. We need trains now, not in 3 months time when the results of the survey have been collated. Please, what can we do?

[Robert Poste's Child]

Apparently the MP for Streatham in the HoC today said that something needs to be done so hopefully that will help keep up the pressure.

[Burbage]

If anyone really wants to know what's going on with Southern, the Transport Select Committee had a pop at both the RMT and Govia Thameslink on Tuesday. You can watch it online or just download the audio and listen to it while you're waiting for a train.

It's not as thrilling as Chilcot and, despite trying to land punches, the MPs didn't sound as if they understood much either, with the questions being more along the lines of 'when's it going to be better' than 'what contingency did you allow for when you took over the franchise and why not?' or "what bit of this billion-pound franchise did you understand before you bid for it?". But they will be reporting at some stage and we may see then.

The upshot is that Govia are doing what the Tories do, and blaming (a) the last franchisees for not hiring any drivers, not training any or letting them go to work for other companies, (b) Network Rail for the unashamed pig's ear of London Bridge and © the Department for Transport, whose perennially sunny prognostications always turn out ludicrous and always result in someone (or everyone) else getting hurt. All these are fair enough targets, I suppose, but assuming they'd all go away was astonishing naivity on Govia's part. Unless, of course, they've worked out that the fines for lousy service would be minimal (as dawned on the MPs around the 11.29 mark), that they get paid no matter how many (or few) passengers they carry and that anyone else taking over the franchises wouldn't, as things stand, make any better a job of it.

For what it's worth, they reckon it'll all be back on target (whatever that is) by the end of the summer, and get better again after that, and certainly within 18 months, by which time they might have trained some drivers.

The RMT dispute seems to be over the amount of safety training that guards will get, though the union representative made the points so badly that the MPs didn't quite seem to catch them. And thus Govia was able to appear to refute them with slithery ease. I doubt it'll be resolved any time soon. But I also doubt that any other franchisee would be minded to do any different.

[ianr]

Mr Chuka Umunna (Streatham) (Lab)

We have reached the end of the track in terms of my constituents? patience with one of the worst train operating companies in the world, Govia Thameslink Railway, which runs Thameslink and Southern lines that are currently masquerading as train services. In its latest attempt to reduce disruption on the Southern line, it is going to cancel up to 350 trains. That is simply unacceptable. It is causing people to lose their jobs, students to miss exams and untold stress. Will the Leader of the House arrange for the Transport Secretary to come and give an urgent statement, and for goodness sake strip this company of this franchise and do so now?

Chris Grayling

May I say first of all that, as someone who also shares GTR routes, I am well aware of the issue? I have every sympathy with what the hon. Gentleman has just said and I have constituents who share his anger. There is a debate on this matter in Westminster Hall next week. I have already spoken to the Rail Minister, who is acutely aware of the issue. What is happening at the moment is simply unacceptable and has to be sorted out.

(Hansard, H. of Commons, 7 July 2016)

There are two related Westminster Hall debates next week.

Wednesday 13 July, 2.30 pm - 4.00 pm Performance of Govia Thameslink rail service - Tim Loughton

Tuesday 12 July, 11.00 am - 11.30 am Compensation for rail passengers - Will Quince

The agenda page of the Transport Select Committee meeting mentioned by Burbage is at http://www.parliament.uk/business/committees/committees-a-z/commons-select/transport-committee/news-parliament-2015/improving-rail-passenger-experience-evidence-16-17/. The "Inquiry: Improving the rail passenger experience" link takes you to written evidence and currently available oral evidence transcriptions as well.

[Monkey]

I posted a letter from govia on this forum last year. They were blaming delays on lack of drivers and everything would be better in April 2016... They've got no idea what they're doing.

[d.b]

I think we're all aware that there have been problems on this line for a while, with all the work going on at London Bridge, many overcomplex routes joining together causing delays through congestion etc.

However I also can't help but think a lot of the operational/staffing related problems could easily be remedied by just spending a little more money. Paying staff enough to attract and retain new drivers, not being cheap about contract offers and antagonizing the RMT. I don't know and don't care what the issues are between Govia and their staff, as a selfish passenger as far as I'm concerned they need to deliver a service and they are getting paid a lot of our ticket money and government subsidy money to deliver it.

Anywhere else in the private sector an inability to deliver an acceptable product would be met with losses, management getting fired, potentially bankruptcy. "Privatised" rail seem to get subsidized to make profits regardless of service so the only incentive they have is to cut costs. It shouldn't surprise us that this is the result...

[bawdy-nan]

I know that this isn't an adequate solution to the overarching problem but, if you are trying to get to London Bridge, the cycle is really not bad at all. Even if you take it at a slow pootling pace and avoid all main roads you can get there in 30 mins.

From Goose Green I'd do Adys, Nutbrook, Maxted, Bellenden Road onto Lyndhurt Way, cross over at the lights to Kelly Avenue, very short stretch of Commercial Way (you can walk this if it feels too scary, though in my experience it isn't at all awful or busy, Chandler Way then into Burgess Park, follow paths to cross park diagonally to come out at Wells Way / Albany Road, short stretch on Albany Road, (again, if nervous easy to walk this), then up Portland Street to Content Street, Rodney Road, Rodney Place then onto pavement cycle path on New Kent Road, cross at crossing onto Meadow Row - from here I wiggle up through BAth Terrace and Trinity Square (but that's because I like the King Alfred statue) but you could join the Southwark Bridge road cycle route and come up towards London Brisge on Union Street ....

It's a nice cycle route - lots to see and not at all trafficy / lycra commuting speed freaks...

There's also the option of joining the entirely off road "quiet route" to Burgess Park at Peckham Library

[goldilocks]

Just going back to Charlie Smith and 'we're going to do a survey' I totally agree with earlier posters that the time for surveys has long gone! The time for surveys was when the service declined from a train every 10 minutes down to approx. 4 per hour. Who on earth is going to think that 3/4 trains over the entire morning rush (ie a 3 hour period) is remotely adequate? In addition - it is at odds with Helen Hayes' previous statements on this that GTR should be stripped of their franchise to run this route.

Unless some clear action is taken by our elected representatives then this 'emergency timetable' will be implemented next week. The question of how franchises are awarded with seemingly no requirement to sign up to a minimum service level on routes is quite staggering - seemingly as long as you can stick to whatever skeleton timetable you put out there, then there are no financial penalties.

It is also clear that the lines through East Dulwich are not profitable for GTR and that our trains are being sacrificed to run more profitable routes. Busses are not a viable alternative for us regardless of what is said - a bus to London bridge can take almost 1 hour, vs the train which used to be 12 minutes! More reason why the route should be passed to TFL - not saying this would be perfect, but its hard to imagine a worse service than now (apart from perhaps just shutting the station).

[mikeb]

Seconding Bawdy Nan - a 30 minute cycle through Bellenden and on the path behind Peckham library will get you to the City very easily and safely, with no need to travel on main roads and with very little sweat i.e. no need for a shower or even to get changed (rain would mean you need mudguards and a cycling coat). In fact, in this weather I tend to arrive fresher than when I pack myself on tube.

I know promoting cycling here tends to very quickly polarise views but I think it probably is the best way to deal with the horrific rail situation over the next 12 months.

[wulfhound]

From Goose Green I'd do Adys, Nutbrook, Maxted, Bellenden Road onto Lyndhurt Way, cross over at the lights to Kelly Avenue, very short stretch of Commercial Way (you can walk this if it feels too scary, though in my experience it isn't at all awful or busy

Straight on in to Cronin Street avoids Commercial Way - at least when they're not digging up all the gas pipes in the estate there. Either way you end up on Chandler Way. It can be pretty busy but for some reason drivers there seem to be much more considerate than around Bellenden.

Chandler Way then into Burgess Park, follow paths to cross park diagonally to come out at Wells Way / Albany Road,

Or take the underpass in the park, take the next path on the right & pop out opposite Portland Street. Roadworks there at the moment which may (or may not) be some much vaunted cycling improvements to that junction which they consulted on last year.