Future Thameslink service from Peckham Rye

[jjjjj]

2tph throughout the day is not enough. Given the poor service it is often necessary to get the train before the one wanted, but when that means losing half an hour which is not always possible.

- A Bellingham - City Thameslink (or into platforms 3/4 of Blackfriars) timed at 15 minutes to the current Sevenoaks services would be much appreciated, however it needs to be throughout the whole day.

It has already been seen how much having a more frequent service results in more use in the London Overground case.

I am also failing to see any benefit from the Thameslink Programme other than new trains, which is not a brilliant pay off to the amount of disruption.

The increase in services from Blackfriars to St Pancras will surely only result in more people at the stations and more more delays to services as more trains will be using the same tracks. There is already lots of congestion reported as an excuse for delays and with more trains it'll only get worse. Rather than adding trains to more destinations the increase in services should be from more services along the current routes. The new destinations planned still mean a change of trains, which so there is no real improvement there.

[Kes]

My expereince is similar to njc97, I usually get the 9.01 from Nunhead, which is rarely on time and recently seems much busier than normal, presmably a knock on effect of the problems with the earlier trains. I can almost always get on but I used to always get a seat and now it's standing, by the time we've been through Denmark hill it's usually packed.

The way back can be pretty bad too, I recently had a train so packed that I had to get off at Denmark Hill and walk back to Nunhead as I felt so ill (and I'm a pretty sturdy type)

[Renata Hamvas]

Thanks all, something I think I need to add to the summary (thanks Ann) is that as some people have rail seasons (either to London terminals or rail issued travelcards ie not on Oyster) with barriers not being present at Catford/Crofton Park/Nunhead/Elephant and Castle and often open at other stations during rush hour, the numbers of users on this line is probably being greatly underestimated. I have also taken on board, longer trains, more frequent service. I have noticed that the Victoria trains (when I've used the stations being discussed)seem to be able to cope with their demand during rush hour and it seems specifically the Thameslink ones that are full above reasonable capacity, could users please confirm/disagree with me on this? (I know the thread heading is about Thameslink!) I'm just trying to get as accurate a picture of everyone's experiences that I can.

Renata

[davidq100]

From my observation I'd agree with your analysis Renata. The Victoria trains do seem (a bit) less packed than the Thameslink trains, although any significant delay or cancellation immediately tips these over the edge too.

The other thing I'd like to mention, although not sure if anything can be done, is the lack of timely information about delays. A good example was yesterday where the 8:33am to Victoria and 8:36am Thameslink were both still showing as being 'on time', even though it was already 8:37am

[njc97]

I havent used the Victoria ones regularly, but they seem better (albeit still a lot more busy than when I did get them 10+ years ago) but oddly whenever I get them home they seem to only be 4/6 carriages, even at peak times, meaning they are rather busy (although better than Thameslink)

[Helenalexandra1]

Thanks Renata, I think you have summed it up: not enough carriages for the amount of people trying to board, not enough trains and the services we have are spaced out oddly (e.g a big gap between 7:37 and 8:04 from Denmark Hill to City Thameslink; then 8:19 and 8:26 on the same route.)

I've also noticed delays creeping into the evening service which used to be rare but tonight the 19:39 from City Thameslink to Sevenoaks was over 15 minutes late.

The service is woefully inadequate and has a negative effect on my mood and my ability to get to important morning meetings(but the lovely man who says good morning at Denmark Hill does cheer me up!)

[Lmcg46]

Yes, I've noticed that the Victoria trains seem far better than the Blackfriars ones. I often look longingly at the seats if I'm there early enough to see that service.

The problems with the Blackfriars trains from Nunhead seem to have been building for some time. I've been using that train for I think 3 years now and it's got steadily busier. There did seem to be a bit of a step change a little while back (maybe about 6 months or so) but I think it was before Thameslink became visible as the brand - not sure if they were involved before it formally changed. The change in the 7.31 is horrible and clearly is affected by some effects further back the line as there can be quite large swings in how busy it is. It's never quiet and you can never get a seat from Nunhead but some days you can get on and some days it's just rammed. So the problems may be occuring elsewhere with other trains being delayed / cancelled and therefore passengers moving onto the stopping service.

[Red_Cat]

Renata, your summary of the situation is spot on, including the Victoria trains not appearing to be as busy. I cannot remember the last time a Thameslink train came on time in the morning and the severe overcrowding and risk of being left on the platform make it every day a very stressful and unpleasant experience getting to work. It is galling also to see trains from Kent with empty seats go straight through the station. I do hope something can be done about it as it appears to be getting worse and worse.

[miga]

.

[Renata Hamvas]

Hi Miga, yes they do, but only at current rates. There was supposed to be double the service, but as the decision has been made to continue the through Wimbledon service (which was going to end), they have scrapped the extra service on this line.

Renata

[davidq100]

Another shocker this morning. Interestingly there was a suprise extra Thameslink service - the 8:24 - which arrived at Peckham Rye at 8:36. It was so full that hardly anyone could get on though. The 8:36 came in at 8:48 and was rammed of course. The Victoria train was >10 mins late too. The system seems really broken at the moment :(

[miga]

.

[Renata Hamvas]

Yes, that's what is planned, but there may possibly be extra Blackfriars ones, but nothing is due to happen for another 3 years!

Renata

[lj57]

miga Wrote:

>

> So trains will still be every 30 minutes? That's a

> little disappointing, though the new trains will

> be nice.

Are they planning new trains without any seats? That's the only way they'll fit everyone on at the current rate!

Thanks for taking this up Renata (and for speedily responding to my email with feedback last week). The London Terminals ticket point is really important. I used to use these and then walk everywhere, as could get to Charing Cross, Waterloo, Canon St (via London Bridge change) easily and cheaply and avoid the tube, but they're all out of the equation now with the LB works. Least I'm getting fitter walking from LB or Blackfriars!

[njc97]

LJ57 - yes the new trains (come 2018) will have more "capacity" with less seats. Hurrah!

[cle]

It's a bit pathetic that this whole Thameslink rebuild will not add any new trains for this line, but I'm not surprised. These investments are for Home Counties people who drop ?5000 on annual tickets, not Oyster users (can we get some more Oyster machines at PR and DH?!)

The Victoria trains are improving and I think will continue to. Next step would be for one down the Catford line, but Thameslink would be preferred for peaks. Victoria is more useful off peak and weekends I think.

Renata - could they look at stopping some of the faster peak Kent Thameslink trains at DH/PR (they stop at Elephant I think) as a bit of relief?

I hope they ditch the Wimbledon trains running through - the new platforms at Blackfriars are a joke.

[jjjjj]

Renata Hamvas Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Hi Miga, yes they do, but only at current rates.

> There was supposed to be double the service, but

> as the decision has been made to continue the

> through Wimbledon service (which was going to

> end), they have scrapped the extra service on this

> line.

> Renata

What's stopping there being 2 through trains per hour and 2 blackfriars trains per hour.

Issues are often to do with trains going beyond blakfriars, so if two terminated there there may be more chance of at least 2 trains being on time.

[cle]

jjjjj Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Renata Hamvas Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Hi Miga, yes they do, but only at current rates.

>

> > There was supposed to be double the service, but

>

> > as the decision has been made to continue the

> > through Wimbledon service (which was going to

> > end), they have scrapped the extra service on

> this

> > line.

> > Renata

>

> What's stopping there being 2 through trains per

> hour and 2 blackfriars trains per hour.

>

> Issues are often to do with trains going beyond

> blakfriars, so if two terminated there there may

> be more chance of at least 2 trains being on time.

And maybe we could have the same. So both routes are 4tph, each with 2 through and 2 terminating at Blackfriars. Seems fair.

[Helenalexandra1]

Trains are definitely broken at the minute. Trains cancelled this morning and the attached picture shows my options for getting back to Denmark Hill from City Thameslink this evening.

Terrible timing with London Bridge issues but appreciate your endeavours, Renata.

[Strawbs]

There was flooding at Farringdon tonight apparently so I ended up on the 63.

[klikker22]

I agree with all that's been said. I've been using the thameslink service from PMR for the past 4 years, and it has steadily got much busier in terms of passenger numbers, but no increase in capacity. Often people can't get on at PMR and DMK on the 8.16 and 8.36 trains from PMR, and both are seriously overcrowded. It is a HORRIBLE commute. They are also both always late (perhaps the arrival times aren't always late as they allow extra time, but departures are definitely always at least 3 or 4 mins late, which is annoying when you are running after dropping kids!...why can't they just schedule it later???) The Victoria trains at similar times (8.13 and 8.33) are emptier, but are also always late.

Another point is that the platform at PMR at these times (when the VIC and Thameslink services coincide) is also downright dangerous, as there are just so many people on it. Particularly near the outside waiting area near stairs where platform is very narrow. Its also very busy on platform 4 at peak evening rush hour. The station wasn't designed as a change-over point really, and it cannot cope with the numbers using it for commuting or changing.

A last point is that the evening trains are really bad from Elephant. I get on earlier so get a seat, but I've seen days where people can't get on at Elephant. The peak is between DMK and Elephant, either morning or evening.

I was thinking about writing to my MP as well about it, as it has got so bad. Would that help?

[JohnL]

St Albans - Brighton not exactly doing well

http://www.hertsad.co.uk/news/thameslink_in_crisis_as_rail_operator_govia_fails_to_improve_service_1_3901821

[spark67]

I have used the 7.34 to get to kentish town from Peckham Rye for about 6 yrs now. It was not to bad to begin with. I steadily moved more to cycling to get fitter and save some money, but used the train more during the winter. Now it's got so horribly over crowded that I find it less stressful cycling in the cold & wet then it is trying get through the passive aggressive scrum to get a foot hold on the train at that time now. I only go now if I'm going out straight from work & can't very well turn up in my cycling gear or drink if I cycle, I dread the commute by train now.

[nunheadmum]

Does anyone know if the morning 7.31 from Nunhead is back to 8 carriages yet?

I avoided it all last week just in case as 4 carriages was almost impossible to get on. But the alternatives aren't as practical.

[ianc]

Avoiding specifics for a moment, and choosing this as one of the many travel threads we seem to have... The combined state of choc-full Thameslink, Overground and services to London Bridge from East Dulwich and the surrounding area makes it somewhat impossible to hold down a job in Central London that starts at 9am these days, without devoting 90+ mins to guarantee getting there on-time each day. And that's ignoring the bus options, which are only options if you can get on within the first few stops of a route and don't mind playing "This bus terminates here" roulette, which throws you off in Camberwell, with subsequent buses unboardable.

Seriously, this must be having an impact way beyond pure travel problems. If a large population can't reliably get into Central London to work.

Interested to hear if our MP(s) or Councillors have raised this more general problem (rather than just the travel specifics on each route).